Intelligent Life On Planet Rock
Thatcher's rehabilitation?
Posted by Lynda Mossman on 27 February 2009 - 1:31pm.
Has anyone else noticed the number of TV retrospectives popping up about our former PM lately? Hot on the heels of Lindsay Duncan's portrayal of Thatcher last night was BBC2's 'The Making of the Iron Lady', charting her rise to power.
Is this an attempt at rehabilitation of a questionable legacy or just fascination with someone who is 'on the way out'? (I live in hope)
PS.I think you have a very talented reviews editor!
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Love her or hate her...
...most people have an opinion about her. And I suspect that's why she makes good television.
By the way Lynda, shameless plugging of one's own website / product is frowned upon in these parts. This includes family members / people with the same surname as you, but as most of the bloggers probably agree with your statement, we'll let you off.
Mrs T
This very subject was broached on the blog earlier today, so you're certainly not the only one who's noticed.
PS. Any relation to our own Kate Mossman? I suspect I already know the answer to this...
On her way out
Do most bloggers here really wish another human being was dead as posted above?.
I'm not looking for a political argument but I wouldn't wish death on anyone just because we have differing views.
I have a friend
whose father was killed in the Falklands conflict. He tells me that the day Thatcher dies will be one of the happiest days of his life.
I'm not condoning or condemning that statement. I'm just using it as a way of demonstrating the fact that there are people out there who wish her dead.
With respect to your friend...
...his father shouldn't have joined the Armed Forces should he, if he didn't want to fight and possibly die for his country, whatever the campaign. That's kind of on the application form isn't it?
Let's not get into politics
it all gets out hand. People have deeply held views on it and well it's friday and sunny in EC1. I'm not stifling debate or curtailing free speech just well let's not fall out again!
Seconded...
Spring seems to have come to the Monnow Valley today.
From my window I can see a host of daffodils about to bloom and a field of lambs doing that cute 'boingy' thing they do.
I can hear the piano tuner at his work downstairs but, if he weren't there, I suspect I could hear the birds singing as well.
Fall out !!!!! ?
I have lived through the Thatcher years, and believe me the "fall out" from that warped mind of of an almost human politician still stings my nostrils with the stench of Tory far right selfishness,and the memories of unemployed youthhood tossed aside in the pursuit of political idealism, her idealism at that. Satisfied at least her own party threw her out, and did she whimper, yes like a whipped dog.Should have found a youths shoulder to cry on, or dare I say a minor (pun) .
Welcome to the Massive, Pete
It's still a nice Spring day outside, although there's a bit of drizzle today that's no bad thing as it'll help the flowers come up nicely. The cherry tree outside my window is looking lovely as it does at this time of year.
See, things aren't so bad after all :-)
Did anyone see Carol Thatcher interview
the mothers of Argentinians killed during the Falklands conflict? It was screened around 6 months ago (I think). Whilst retaining their dignity the women interviewed made it clear there wouldn't be much rehabilitation forthcoming from them. One of the few occasions I've seen Carol Thatcher at a loss for words.
Sir 4tune8, there was
Sir 4tune8, there was another one of these occasions last week when Miss Thatch was on the Wright Stuff and mein host put it to her as to what exactly had transpired in the green room of the One Show - cue much nervously swigging at water, twitching with mental ants-in-her-pants, before delivering a curt 'twas a private matter' stylee line, and then that fine character and fellow guest Richard Herring charmingly told her exactly why so many people found her supposed outburst so offensive and why she should apologise. No response, just more silent discomforture on her part and mentally counting the seconds to the next advert break.
As for her old dear, I too will be knocking back some celebratory Guinnesses on the day she croaks and heads off to the hot place, but such characters like her old chum Pinochet do have a habit of hanging around for decades, don't they?
Who thought that was a good idea?
Sending Carol Thatcher to Argentinian berieved! Who on earth thought that was a good idea? Ignore the crass insensativity, well sorry most people couldn't. Some one in tv land could because they sent her and obviously dear old Carol could. I wonder how it ran in the conference room "I've got a good idea, lets interview people who have lost their nearest and dearest and use as interviewer the offspring of the person they blame. It'll make great tv". You couldn't make it up.
However bad the idea was
she still went. But then she isn't a glowing example of well thought out personal opinions is she?
It was called "Mummy's War"
I agree; what looks like, on paper a real stinker (the title makes it even worse), actually provided a moment of memorable viewing. Maybe becasue I missed the bit where Carol visited the Falklands and bathed in the reflected glory of her mother. I only caught the last bit, where I presume for "balance" Carol was put face to face with the mothers, and was fairly quickly reduced to saying "well, you started the war", making it clear she felt they had no one but themselves to blame.
The pay off came in the final exchange, when one of the mothers asked Carol if her mother was in good health. Seeing an opportunity to end the interview on a concilatory note Carol beamed "Yes she's very well". To which the reply was "One day God will punish her".
From the
Monkey Tennis school of idea development?
"someone who is 'on the way out'? (I live in hope)"
I think it's more than a little distasteful to wish any person dead in that way. It's certainly not what I come here for.
I wished...
...Jade Goody dead and, would you believe it!
(I'm very, very sorry.)
Incidentally, regarding Mrs. T, up here in Liverpool there's not much sensitivity regarding her inevitable death, you'll be startled to hear. Not only do I know someone who's got a bottle of champagne in the fridge which he won't drink until he's certain she's pegged it, but there's also a street party planned for the announcement. (On Hope Street outside the Casa if you're in the area).
Sick? Oh yes. But that's hatred for you.
Not sure that's sick...
I just think it's a sad indictment of the way some people view a fellow human being.
Where do you stand on this then?
Contemptible.
In my mind, there's no excuse for wishing death on another human being.
Of all the people for him to choose, it seems bizarre for him to pick on Rupert Murdoch who, as far as I can tell is no better or worse than any other successful businessman.
Sorry, but...
Personally, I'm with Weller on this one. We shouldn't wait for her to die as she should be shot as a traitor to the people. Is that plain enough for you. I met her once too when I was about 8 or 9 (she opened our junior school when she was Education Minister. Unlike the posters above she didn't charm me, I could smell the evil on her even at that age!
Other people's opinions vary of course...
But as has been said in previous threads, this isn't really the place to discuss party politics
Keeping it on music...
This would be the Weller that said he'd voted for the Conservatives in 79?
from 1978
-Would you vote in The next election?
I dunno, maybe I’ll vote for Labour. I don’t really wanna talk about politics, I’m not clever enough.
I think it was earlier when he said he'd vote conservative - not that he had voted conservative - he soon made it plain where his political affiliations lay whilst in The Jam.
Didn't Obama receive a "Best of The Jam" cd
from David Cameron? I wonder, with Weller earning to pay the school fees, which way he'll be voting this time? Blue Wedge sounds a bit Trivial Pursuit to me.
We always used to call 'em
'cheeses' when playing Triv.
Dumbing down?
I was a tad obsessed with Weller (Jam and TSC) as a callow youth but recently I must admit to finding his 'man of the people, ordinary geezer' thing a bit disappointing. In the early days of the Style Council he could be a pretentious twat admittedly but I am alone in preferring his Cappuccino years to his (ongoing) Stella years? Paolo Hewitt's book opened my eyes, sadly.
On his support for the Tories in the late 70's, I have no problem with that, and the fact that he was a rare genuine working class presence in the public school dominated (and therefore of course solidly leftish) punk clique is instructive. Discuss.
What´s it like ?
Can you really smell evil ? What´s it smell like? Were all the other cool super-hero powers taken ?
Does this apply across the world at all times?
Presumably it would have been wrong to wish for the death of Hitler, Pol Pot, Pinochet, Stalin and just about any other mass murderer you care to name. We are still paying the price for what became known as 'Thatcherism' (in reality a combination of greed, suburban prejudice and the destruction of manufacturing in this country). She destroyed whole communities across the north of England. I won't be shedding any tears and might be tempted to attend celebrations if any are going on locally. Or, I might host one.
As a general principle, yes...
it would have been wrong. I don't believe in "an eye for an eye" and so I can't see any justification for wishing death on a fellow human being.
As for your assesment of Thatcherism - other people have a different opinion and feel it was the best thing ever to happen to this country - but this isn't the place to discuss party politics. We can go to the Guardian blog for that.
(Oh and I'm not particularly a Rush fan but the Geddy Lee quote seemed apposite)
"No better or worse than any other successful businessman"?????
"In my mind, there's no excuse for wishing death on another human being.
Of all the people for him to choose, it seems bizarre for him to pick on Rupert Murdoch who, as far as I can tell is no better or worse than any other successful businessman."
Excuse me? Is there anything more despicable than the Sun Newspaper or Fox News? I suggest you look up "Hillsborough" and "Jeremy Glick"
How about Robert Mugabe
for starters...
If you don't read the Sun, Rupert Murdoch isn't going to evict you from your house, burn it down, then rape your wife.
Or do you believe he does that sort of thing in his spare time?
He's not such a bad chap in
He's not such a bad chap in comparison to Robert Mugabe. Hardly the most glowing recommendation is it?
How, exactly, is Murdoch's behaviour any worse than...
...other similar businessmen? As far as I can tell, you object to him because he runs a tabloid newspaper and an American TV network.
Rupert Murdoch
I never said a thing about other businessmen, that's your comparison.
I object to Rupert Murdoch because he runs a tabloid newspaper like this (go 2min30secs in)
and an American TV network like this
The sun TV reviewer also described Dennis Potter as "Mr Flaky" for his psoriasis. Charming.
*shrug*
Then don't buy the paper or watch the channel. You have a choice.
???
Oh come off it, ruthless gutter journalism being turned on the victims of tragedies should appall anyone. I doubt you'd be so blase if it was one of your family members that got falsely reported as urinating on dying people. Would "don't buy the paper" be a good enough apology then? Though as it happens, the people of Liverpool have taken your advice and haven't bought his scummy rag in twenty years. But taking this all into account, a dying playwright, who's disease had been ridiculed in said rag is the real villain here?
Mr Flaky
is, doubtless, a cruel jibe. Wishing someone dead notches it up a level and so is indefensible.
Only if you mentally block
Only if you mentally block out all the other viciously cruel and destructive journalism that Murdoch's been responsible for like Hillsborough and the Jeremy Glick interview.
Do you think the Sun's Hillsborough slander is only worthy of a shrug?
Yes...
It's a newspaper. They make mistakes. Get over it.
It's clear that, if anyone were at fault, it was Kelvin McKenzie. He chose to run the story and he chose to give it such prominence. Murdoch had no involvement in the story (cf Chippendale & Horrie).
None of which comes close to wishing death on another human being.
Extra, Extra, read all about it
Murdoch forced Kelvin Mackenzie, the editor of The Sun at the time, to issue an apology for that Hillsborough smear - then, when he no longer worked for the Roop, Mackenzie retracted the apology.
Facts is facts, eh.
Who set the parameters where
Who set the parameters where Mackenzie thought he could get away with a story like that? Who was Mackenzie trying to impress? Who did Murdoch back to stand against David Davies in 2007, and rehired as a columnist?
And we're not talking about one slip up in an otherwise noble bastion of the press. A story like this was inevitable. A rag that since the late sixties, when Murdoch took it over, has dragged journalism into the sewer. And been ruthlessly used to trample on anyone that got in his, or his right-wing friends way. Just cause Murdoch wet himself when he realised he was going to lose an entire region of readers forever brings little credit to him. Anyone fancy telling the family members of Hillsborough victims to "get over it"?
John Pilger documentary on the decline of the tabloid press, well worth a view for anyone interested in this subject
You are joking, yes?
Murdoch's contribution to the cheapening and coarsening of our civil society is matched only by Thatcher's. That makes him considerably worse than, say, Alan Sugar or Richard Branson.
Your defence of him puts me in mind of one of my favourite article titles. It's by Ayn Rand: "America's real oppressed minority - big business."
I applaud your high moral stance re death-wishing but do not share it, I'm afraid.
Party time
Can we in the South celebrate in a similar manner when Scargill pops his clogs? Oh, go on. It'll be fun.
And can I write a song and call it Morrissey On The Guillotine?
Er, thought not.
Have a read of The Shock Doctrine by Niaomi Klein
It is fairly damning of Thatcher but not in isolation of other world leaders, global corporations, universities and economists of the same era. The people with power were all abusing it. Not sure of my point other than there are a list of people and sometimes singling out Thatcher lets the others get away with it.
it's still a nice day out
the sun's starting to come round to my side of the building in the late afternoon now after long winter.
Could it having something to do with...
The thirtieth anniversery of a Labour Government overseeing the collapse of the economy and being thrown out by bankrupt electorate?
To quote Geddy Lee...
"Plus ca change, plus ce la meme-chose"
My mother in laws favourite saying
is the 'Apple doesn't fall far from the tree'.We have a perfect example of that with Carol Thatcher who is as loathsome as her mother. I saw the documentary in question and in truth she came across as absolutely vile - no surprise there then. She also seems ignorant of the answer to the statement 'you started the war' - I would argue that her mother created the war as a way of reviving her then flagging unpopularity and the Belgrano was clearly going in the opposite direction to the exclusion zone when it was mercilessly sunk. I dont understand why people are surprised at the strong views on here. I am pretty sure there were millions gladdened by the death of Hitler.If I lost a loved one through someone elses inhumane actions I dont think they would be on my Christmas card list.
That reminds me...
...haven't seen Dave Spart in Private Eye for a few years now :-)
The magic word
And thus, thankfully, Godwin's Law has duly been invoked.
Next thread!
Archie...
...how do you know this stuff?
*sits back in awe*
I think Godwin’s Law needs adapting
for our own little playpen. For Hitler read Richard Thompson.
Can't do that...
...few threads would last more than 4 or 5 posts
I didn't like her very much
..but the preceding government, with endless strikes, three day week, Winter of Discontent, unburied bodies, piles of rubbish everywhere etc made it pretty inevitable that a big change was a comin'. If the Social Contract had been given any sort of run we might never have had Thatcher in the first place. Reap what you sow.
Three day week . .
. . was brought in by the Tories
Maybe
..but it was all part of the groundswell for change which brought us Margaret Thatcher. I was discussing it with my Mum, a lifetime Labour voter, who remembers that the strong feeling was that something had to change as life was unbearable, and she seemed to be something different.
I am wondering whether Elvis Costello...
...will indeed "Tramp the dirt down" - I'm sure some journo is going to ask him about it when she does pop off.
As if..
Pit closures, rioting, the sinking of the Belgrano, the collapse of the manufacturing base, the privatisation of everything, the destruction of the trade union movement, the Poll Tax and mass unemployment werent enough.
Now shes responsible for making me listen to Rush.
Wasn't bothered before but now? Die, bitch, Die!!
I guess if the Labour government
hadn't bankrupted the country and become unelectable by '79, she wouldn't have needed to have been elected but hey, on recent evidence it seems to happen everytime you leave the Labour party in charge of the country.
Never mind, here's some more Rush
Toryboy
I see. So you've moved from " Oh don't let's spoil things with all this politics talk" and "Rupert Murdoch - no worse than anyone else eh?" To just straight old Tory propaganda.
Still, I'm gratified to find that my Ayn Rand quote in a comment to one of your previous posts was uncannily prescient:-)
*shrug*
Still, it's a lovely spring day outside and the world is still turning so, hey-ho :-)
Thirty years on, Thatcherism is bankrupt
Great article by Johann Hari on the failure of Thatcherism
"Thirty years on, Thatcherism is bankrupt
Yet there it stands, unchallenged, as the road-map for our future"
http://www.johannhari.com/archive/article.php?id=1504
But what about....
Would that be the same manufacturing base (e.g. digging coal out of the ground so that we can burn it) that many of the same people who vociferously backed the miners in the 80s now want to end immediately for a different reason (to avoid Armageddon according to that nice Mr. Gore...)? Just wondered.
I am now heavily armed
dangerous and googling the words "Thatcher" and "Home Address".
Bring me the head of Geddy Lee!
Just to push you over the edge
Here's South Park doing Rush :-)
new
At last I have meet some like minded souls who are going to get drunk when the wicked witch dies. I have said this for years to my wife that the day she dies im taking the day off work and hitting the drink. Im might even head over to Liverpool for the street party although I suspect there will be a few over here. Roll on the day when its breaking news on BBC 24.COME ON !
I think you're all missing the point...
As a historical drama filmed in the style of House of Cards it was a very interesting work. If you want to discuss Thatcher's legacy I suggest you go to Guardian Talk.
Having said that, the portrayal of John Major was a very interesting one, and having met Denis Thatcher once, I can say that the actor who played him was spot on. I particularly liked the swearing a la In The Thick of It, particularly from Heseltine, who actually appeared to look like the Spitting Image puppet.
I presume the music in the drama, a wonderfully menacing piece in the style of Eno's "In Dark Trees", was written for the programme, but if anyone knows differently I'd be interested in getting my hands on it.
Sorry I missed it now
and for being missing in transit yesterday. I saw the trailers and thought it as a comedy, in the style of Michael Sheen as Tony Blair.
Where I worked in the 80s we were given time off to nip up the road to see Milksnatcher speak in an election rally, in a field between Bury & Ramsbottom.
Observations of a young man - she is tiny, Dennis looked like the buffoon he was always portrayed as and why the hell did they have to have a police frogman in the pond behind the makeshift stage all the time she was outstanding in her field? (oh no she wasn't...).
That's it. Did I forget power-craved politician rather than public servant? That fits so many though...
DEATH TO THATCHER
would seem to be the populist view here then - apart from the Rush fan. I still can't be bothered to listen to them though.
Thatcher
It seems appropriate to close this thread with a quote from Kaththyn Flett 'On Television' in today's Observer...
"Perhaps it's simply that for any of us who grew up detesting Margaret Thatcher in a wholly visceral sort of way, believing her to be the architect of all that is politically incorrect......and the standard bearer for overwhelming hubris and sundry other horribleness - not to mention the worst kind of high-profile woman, the dreaded "man's woman", ever to have been bequeathed to the sisterhood - the current trend for respectful revisionism is slightly repugnant."
but, as always, there's an opposing view
to Flett which is that for everyone who spent the last 30 years railing against Thatcher, there's someone who actually took advantages of the opportunities she provided and started a business.
Many of those business are still going today, steadily generating wealth for the country and those who made the effort to get off their arse and take advantage of the opportunity presented to them.
Thatcher
I despise Thatcher and everything she stood for and believe her deregulation policies are at the root of our current economic woes. I won't shed a tear when she dies, but must still admit a slight admiration for her.
I do admire the way she clawed her way to the top of her party despite being a woman, and one from a relatively ordinary background at that, in a party full of toffs and grandees. The toffs are back in charge now.
As a nation we like to think we are strong, but in the face of Thatcher we rolled over and died. If we had been more militant, like the French, we might still have some industry left instead of the now empty husks of many of the "key" service industries, such as financial services, which we were assured would replace them.
Shame on Thacher, but shame on us for giving in to her.
I feel more contempt...
...for Blair who singularly failed to rise to the challenge placed before him, and blew the chance to change the country in the wake of Thatcherism.
After years in opposition, he had a genuine chance - and a public mandate - to make widespread changes and what did he do? Nothing. Kept on as before with an ever so sligtly diluted form of what we had before.
agree, at least partly.....
yes, he blew it. Thatcher made a difference (if not a positive one in the long term, in my opinion.) Blair did not; his mantra was don't rock the boat and we'll get re-elected - exemplified by his mealy mouthed approach to foxhunting; he was scared of upsetting anyone, even a minority. You don't make an omelette without cracking eggs though.
Anyone with an ounce of brain could see the economic bubble bursting - but this government did not want to see it; as long as the electorate was feeling good, despite the massive debt being built up in the background, it was happy to let things run on as it might mean another term if the bubble did not burst in advance of the next election. As it happens, it did and we all lose, apart from the Tories, who will soon be back in power and who will be no better than Labour.
On reflection
I've deleted my post as, whatever my personal political standpoint, this is not the place to discuss it.
Why not?
It seems like a healthy and robust debate to me.
Did anyone else think
That if Thatcher had been as foxy as Lindsay Duncan, most men would have gladly gone on the dole for her? It was a great programme, but in reality she was an ugly old baggage. Not that I wish her dead, mind. Not really us, is it?
Anyroad, to blame Mrs T solely for the job losses of the early 80s is to ignore the fact that there was a global recession on; personalising it is the territory of those clowns blaming Robin Peston for the current one. Also, I read a very persuasive argument for the sheer scale of redundancies in the 80s being a by-product of chief accountants' first acquaintance with the IBM PC - at last they could crunch their own numbers in Supercalc or Visicalc or Lotus 1-2-3 and this ability to produce their own 'what-if?' scenarios led to P45's all round.
A view from afar
Yes, Thatcher caused untold misery for the citizens of the UK (and Argentina or that matter), don't forget that she was aided and abetted by Ronald the Raygun (check out Gil Scott Heron's B-Movie to hear him speared mercilessly), and played yes-girl to his imperial ambitions. The US has certainly not been free of this kind soft shoe dictator, Kennedy/LBJ/Nixon all share the blame for "Nam, and of course the most recent occupant of the White House. The less said the better? Anyway, as a believer in karma, I know that they will, or have, a price to pay for their misdeeds.
A point of fact
It would be more accurate to say "Thatcherism caused untold misery for some of the citizens of the UK..."
which isn't much of a defence
really, is it?
Who talked about 'a defence'?
I was just being factually correct.
Received wisdom
I guess that what we hear in the US is that Thatcher caused untold misery for UK citizens, clearly thats not the case, but, this thread certainly leans in that direction. During the eighties everything you heared about MT was positive, doubtless run through the Reagan spin-omittor before reaching the public. With the nineties that view did start to change. It all depends on who you hear it from. The point I wanted to make was that we (US & UK) have both had our share of political ogres, and, that they have often been enablers for each other.
That'd be because...
...those of us that actually took the opportunities that Thatcherism provided were too busy working hard, building successful businesses to have the time to shout about it.
Stimpy
you did well out of Thatcherism - we get it, well done you. Some people did. Some people had their lives wrecked. You didn't, you did well.
Exactly, as many did well as didn't...
...remember Basildon Man? I'm just trying to bring some balance to the discussion without resorting to childish name-calling like many of the correspondents here.
Hmm
As many? Really?
The evidence for that is contentious at best. Vast swathes of the north of England, parts of the Midlands, the South West and Scotland were laid waste by the most rapacious demands of Thatcherism. Many were not afraid of hard work and tried to do well, but were roundly shat upon as a result. They weren't so lucky.
The south east seemed to do rather well. And where was her power base?
Some of what Thatcher did was necessary (like the privatisation of BT, which helped global telecoms). But lots of it wasn't (like privatisng utilities and deregulation of much of the public transport system) and, in the process she threw both baby and bathwater. And she didn't really have to enjoy it quite as much as she appeared to. Many of the social problems we see now are the result of ripping apart communities and having no coherent stategy in place to deal with the aftermath (a bit like an economic version of the Iraq shambles that came later with Blair, My Little Phony). Credit deregulation and the destruction of locally accountable services, together with huge amounts of centralisation of power have had serious effects which persist to this very day.
Remember, this was the woman who stood on a podium and said, utterly straight-faced that, "there is no such such thing as society, only the individual and the family." If that is not an indication of the intellectual bankruptcy of Thatcherism (from her own piched and strident lips), then what is?
I don't wish anyone dead, but I won't shed any tears for her when she's gone.
Can't say I'll be too
Can't say I'll be too bothered when Maggie dies. I won't mourn her in any way. Terrible woman, divisive politically and many many people up in the north despise her. I was at Uni with a lad from a mining village near Doncaster and he REALLY hated her.
As for Murdoch and why Potter disliked him. It was nothing to do with his businesses as such, just what he had done to journalism and the press in his time. Listen to what Potter says and it becomes clear.
Maggie
Bitch! I hate her I hate her I hate her and I'm throwing a party when she dies. Kinnock would have been so much better. But then the privatisation of BT would never have happened...and we wouldn't be having this lively discussion. Dial-up, anyone?
Oh bugger. Hooray for Maggie!
the final word
That Frankie Boyle
He's a lark, isn't he?
I think Elvis should get the last word personally...
One good thing I have to say...
About Margaret and Adolf .. They both loved 'their' countries and wanted 'their' best for them ...shame they weren't the same countries and 'best' the majority of us believed in or wished for.
Adolf?
I think that successfully invokes Godwin's Law :-)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law
I had read Godwin's law before posting.... shame you hadn't..
"However, Godwin's Law itself can be abused, as a distraction or diversion, that fallaciously miscasts an opponent's argument as hyperbole, especially if the comparisons made by the argument are actually appropriate. A 2005 Reason magazine article argued that Godwin's Law is often misused to ridicule even valid comparisons"
Which is all completely irrelevant
the law is actually invoked on a Forum when a poster compares a fellow poster to a Nazi thereby diminishing their argument...I thought I had compared a maniacal nationalist demagogue with another ... a fair comparison I thought.
Here's what Godwin himself says http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/2.10/godwin.if_pr.html
And the day I take notice of an American attorney [ even if he was former Editor of The Daily Texan is the day I die.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Godwin
Dear heart, there was a smiley
in my posting. It's all just a bit of fun :-)
Sorry...
that did come across as a bit of a rant ... I just get anoyed by American Attorneys.
Thatcher games
If you want a light-hearted break, you could try the games at http://www.maggiethatcher.com/games.html or join the Thatcher's death flash mob at http://www.flashmobdeath.tk
To be fair that seems the antithesis of lightheartedness ...
Thatcher's gone... forget her [ the best remedy I always find ]However I'd be slightly dismayed if she got a State funeral .. unless it was a budget one and held in Grantham..
Reading the posts one gets
Reading the posts one gets the impression that during Thatcher's time the Prime Minister was some kind of super-politician in charge of everything. Is that the same job that Major and Blair had and which was always described as "no matter what they promise during the election, they can't do anything, it's all party politics..."??
Isn't it all a bit studenty
to hate Thatcher with such a passion?
I used to - 20 years ago. Now I couldn't care less.