Entertainment For Lively Minds
Standing on the shoulders of giants
Posted by David Hepworth on 14 January 2008 - 9:16am.
I see that Judy Kuhn is getting fabulous reviews in New York for her new show which channels the music of the late Laura Nyro. This comes at the same time as we're waiting for the new Shelby Lynne album which is entirely made up of songs made famous by the equally deceased Dusty Springfield. In this she has to be encouraged by the success that Madeleine Peyroux had in reminding everybody of Billie Holiday.
Is it ever acceptable to make a career on the back of the legacy of a dead artist this way and why is is so often female performers who do it?
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Not forgetting
Rufus Wainwright and his Judy Garland tribute. Personally, I really enjoyed hearing Dusty In Memphis and I Am Shelby Lynne at exactly the same time - eight years ago; I know, I was late with Dusty - and hearing the similarities; which is why I consider what she's doing now to be (a) a bit late and (b) a bit of a cop-out.
As they say
nostalgia aint what it used to be, but it does sell by the bucket load.
To Be Frank
Frank Sinatra's son seems to be making a good living on the back of his father's legacy. I can't see that there's too much harm in it myself. As the world continues to evolve, certain members of society will always crave nostalgia, buttered crumpets, a hot toddy and good old play on Radio 4 whilst sat next to a roaring fire.
I don't see that it's
I don't see that it's any different from generations of performers and musicians "making a career" playing the works of Shakespeare or Beethoven.
It's a body of work that can't be performed by the people who first created it, yet people still want to see it done by people who can recreate it well or perhaps even add a new dimension to it.
Because pop/rock music is a relatively young art/entertainment form it seems a bit odd, a bit tacky and slightly wrong for people to do this. But, if you think it through, it isn't.
It's probably an unworthy thought but...
...is is possible that Ben Taylor occasionally muses on what he'll do when his father James hands in his lunch pail? Start dropping "Fire and Rain" into the set, maybe? It's only like carrying on the family business, after all. In fact I've recently interviewed Touimani Diabate, who's the 71st in a line of musicians. One of his first recordings was a remake of his father's album "Anciwent Strings" called - fanfare - "New Ancient Strings"!
Juggler & Son
Wasn't it fairly common in circus/variety circles for "turns" to pass on their skills from generation to generation, i.e keep the family firm going with the same name above the door?
Then there was Menudo
That was the Puerto Rican boy band who refreshed their personnel just like a football team would have done. You shave, you get your cards.
The Pet Shop Boys
The Pet Shop Boys loved that idea and once talked about doing the same thing, i.e. replacing themselves with younger personnel. They were only half joking.
I think it's OK when it's done a little more subliminally...
Good examples being...
KD Lang ... Patsy Cline
Rod Stewart when he was good ... Sam Cooke
Oh...
I see you inserted an "S" on the end of "shoulder". Take note, Noel Gallagher.
Was deliberate
I believe he intended it to be singular to emphasise his place relative to his heroes - as in he's so tiny - uncharacteristic of him though. Pretty bad album too.
Makes no grammatical sense whatsoever
How can he be standing on the shoulder of giants? If there's more than one giant.
And if you stood on just the one shoulder...
....you would surely fall off.
Depends how big the giant is
Or rather how big the giant's shoulder is. If it's a really giant giant it could be ten feet wide. And if there were say five giants that's one giant's shoulder for each Manc gobshite.
Then wouldn't it be
Standing at the shoulder of giants?
(ahem)
I actually really like that album, with the exception of the not very good I Can See a Liar and Put Your Money Where Your Mouth Is.
Go Let It Out, Sunday Morning Call, Roll It Over are all great and Gas Panic ranks among their very best moments.
I even like Little James, but that's possibly due to just becoming a Dad myself.
Sorry to go on
But surely one can't stand 'at' or 'on' the 'shoulder' of giants. One can if there's only one giant, sure; but as soon as there's more than one, 'shoulder' has to be plural whether you're standing on or at one giant's shoulder, or standing on or at one as part of a collective whole.
Yes?
It's possible that I'm spending too much time on this and not enough time on my dissertation on Bob Dylan.
Never in my wildest dreams...
would I have imagined that one tiny little post of mine would spark such an involved discussion of spelling and grammar. That's what you get on this site, you see... clever people.
Agreed
it doesn't really work does it?
I was looking
to see who I could blame for starting it.
Errr...
sorry about that.
Just one thing though
Why didn't anyone with half a brain in Noel's employ point it out to him when he came up with the title? Were they all too busy rubbing their chins & nodding sagely?
This reminds me of the story of rehearsals for 'The Wiz'. Michael Jackson had to deliver a line mentioning Socrates. He'd never heard of either the philosopher or the 40-a-day Brazilian midfielder & kept pronouncing the 2nd & 3rd syllable as one - 'crates', as in 'boxes'. Quincy Jones was happening by, noticed this & took Jacko aside to tell him the correct pronounciation. Everyone else involved had either been too starstruck or too reliant on Jackson's continued grace & favour to point it out.
Sorry, how did I get here?
Giants and Shoulders, Newtons and Hookes
Noel picked it up from the inscription on a £2 coin; the source of the line on the coin is Newton in a letter to his rival scientist Hooke, 'If I have seen a little further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants.' Someone much better informed than me wrote to a music magazine (possibly even Word) to point out that this could have been taken as a dig - Hooke was rumoured to have a severe stoop so Newton was saying that if he had picked up ideas from another scientist then it certainly wasn't his correspondent.
For more than you probably want to know see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standing_on_the_shoulders_of_giants
Good old Wikipedia
So this is the reason for the confusion:
"After seeing the inscription on a £2 coin, Noel Gallagher of British band Oasis decided to name their fourth studio album after it, but in his mildly inebriated state, wrote down the inscription as Standing on the Shoulder of Giants."
Anyway back to the subject . . .
I once had the misfortune to see John Carter Cash on a bill with the late Johnny Cash and the only reason he was there was because he was his father's son. Little discernible talent (well to my ears anyway).
Seems to be across all fields - Hank Williams Jr, John Lee Hooker Jr, Jeff Buckley, Dweezil Zappa, Devon Allman and Jason Bonham being the names that spring immediately to mind. Mind you I saw Paul Rodgers' kids at the Strat Pack gig many yeras ago and they were good - don't know if they ever did much more though.
I think, unless it really is a pale imitation of what their father or mother did it's quite acceptable as long as the artiste has talent. I recently saw Devon Allman in the UK and he was superb, sufficiently different from his father to make it interesting and yes he did do "One Way Out" and "Midnight Rider".
Bloody well too !
It ought to have been
"squished beneath the boots of giants".
'twould be a far more appropriate fate for the lairy moptop robbing loudmouths.
Having said that, it's been a bit quiet on the Oasis front for a while now. Do you think they are having trouble changing their strings, or have they managed that challenge only to discover that you then need to retune?
Hopefully
They've realised that they ran out of presentable material in about 1996, and this has led them to the natural conclusion not to make any more music.
And then I woke up.
Music?
Is that what it was?
I thought it was plagiarism.