Socialist Party
In response to Kaiser Hepworth's overly harsh dig, I may actually launch one. Nah, not some Marxist-Leninist cadre but a red shindig.
Stick some Redskins/Motown/prime-time punk on the stereo, crack open the cheap Cuban liquor or Czech Budvar, roll back the carpet and then play pin the tail on Phil Collins or use the Thatcher dartboard.
All welcome as long you pledge an oath to flick Vs at the telly whenever the Grantham gorgon rocks up. Should be a blast.
ps Surprised no one's yet picked up on Maggies role in subjugating the fascists goons at the polls- by nicking both their racist policies and their voters.
- More from Paul Holmes.
- Login or register to post comments








I was abruptly woken up
the other evening whilst Mrs Collibosher was watching the Invisibles on the idiot box. Right slap bang in the middle of it someone had slipped Kick Over The Statues on the soundtrack.
Extra! Extra! Read All About It!
Berry Gordy‘s a “socialist”. Now that’s Headline News.
changed me mind
changed me mind
Flicking V's at the telly?
That'll show 'em, Rik.
genuine question
isn't the apostrophe in V's aberrant? It ain't possessive. Hey, we may be kerrrrazy revolutionary hepcats, but we're grammar mavens too, innit
Oh Yes
Things may come and things may go but good grammar goes on forever (Pace Pete Brown)
An apostrophe is acceptable here
It is allowed for plurals of letters.
At the risk
of running foul of the FAQ checkers, it doesn't. Hence, it's CDs, not CD's but its not it's, oddly. Cripes, I'm getting a bit bleeding didactic
It should be isn't
rather than doesn't, shouldn't it?
How Quaint
Only in England, and Word, could a heated debate on political matters degenerate or , indeed , elevate into a spat on good grammar. You´re all quite mad, you know.
Oh Phil
Look up irony in the dictionary, old sport. Kerist, I expected people to have a sensayuma.
PS Hasn;t the Young Ones dated, hmmm?
PPSSS I'm callling the bash Chez Guevara. Yer all invited. Bar Phil and Lowey, capisce?
PPPSS Apropos of Richard. What about the Power to the Motown People CD then? Berry may not have been a card-carrier etc but the likes of Inner-City Blues, War and even There Ain't Nobody Straight in LA were civil rights masterpieces. Meanwhile, Trot hotshots The Redskins were signed to capitalist running dogs Decca but the message was never subverted.
Motown was a shamelessly capitalist enterprise
run along the lines of the local Ford motor company (hence the name). It may have fostered great art, but what counted was the bottom line. Internally the artist, writers and producers fought like ferrets in a sack for the opportunity to score the biggest hits. There was no room for sentiment. Even a proven hitmaker like Smokey Robinson - who you‘d have though would have been cut a bit of slack - was bumped off the prestiguous and lucrative Tempations account in 1966 after a couple of flops. Norman Whitfield, who took his place, got into the songwriting business when he saw what Smokey was driving. Tamla Motown made The Apprentice look like a hippy commune.
They may have been prominent supporters of the civil rights movement and, some at least, opponents of the Vietnam war, but if you’d called most of the prominent Motown people “socialist” they’d have laughed in your face.
And didn't Berry Gordy write this one?
He also furiously opposed
the release of Marvin Gaye’s “What’s Going On” album, which was sneaked out behind his back. Not because of its political content. But because he thought it wouldn’t sell.
None of
which invalidates my points. And I'd did disagree on latter assertion
Well except the idea that Motown music is “socialist”
You don‘t have to be a “socialist” to think that racial discrimination is stupid and wrong; or that war is best avoided if at all possible. All decent, rational people think that too. And not all decent rational people are “socialists”; something that “socialists” often don’t quite understand.
Sensayuma?
In the photo and the profile, I thought. (Deep breath), anyway...
Apols
guv. Cap duly doffed. You've won a free shot at me!
No problem, Paul...
...although I might just bide my time...
the free market generates better art and music
Than socialist society can.
(And better football teams, quality of concrete and better looking girls, too; how come all russian lasses used to look like shotputters but now look like tennis players.....)
Discus(s)..
This wwins the award
for the facile post ever!
facile, really?
For a start, I can't think of a single significant contemporary music act from a socialist country, can you?
And no, motown was not a socialistic institution. And no, billy bragg isn't significant.
During the last 90 years the filthy capitalist west gave birth to jazz, blues, rocknroll,electronica, soul, hip hop, pop and continues to spew out new forms of music (house,grime etc)
I suspect that the nature of a free market world gives people the chance to try and fail. And it is only through experimentation and by being different that new things are created. Hence capitalism will always be more likely to encourage great art whilst socialism (which at its root wants people to be tha same and have the same) will hinder it.
Keep on rockin' in the free world
I remember marching and crying 'Jobs not bombs' and 'Maggie Maggie Maggie out out out'. All that unemployment and youth on the dole with nothing better to do than form bands while living on benefits - those were the days.
Socialist countries? You mean undemocratic totalitarian regimes don't you? When was there ever a truly socialist country? But you can have a free democracy with a mixed economy and socialist redistributive policies and good pop music too - they managed it in parts of Scandanavia OK, like Sweden I believe.
Socialism is rather (simplistically and generally) about everyone being treated equally, not everyone being the same. Isn't China a capitalist coumtry now? Are you free to make any music you want there - don't think so? It's not whether it's a socialist or capitalist system (a distinction which is pretty out of date really, in the sense that those polar opposites no longer really exist in the world today as us and them), but whether your government prevents you making the music you want to - that's the important thing. Capitalism doesn't guarantee freedom of expression. Anyway, great art is made against the odds regardless.
Thank you Sven
for putting all that so eloquently. I couldn't have contained myself enough to have composed such a graceful and masterly reply.
You
are too kind.
Against all odds
It dawned on me the other day that two great, great, great albums mentioned either on this blog or in its august parent organ recently - John Martyn's One World and Dennis Wilson's Pacific Ocean Blue - came out in 1977, and it'd be hard to think of two records that were swimming more resolutely against the general tide of Year Zero.
Does this mean we can safely conclude that X-Ray Spex's "Oh Bondage Up Yours" was not great art? Noddarf!
1977.
A good year for music 1977 - Bowie 'Low' and 'Heroes', Television 'Marquee Moon', Neil Young 'American Stars and Bars', Kraftwerk 'Trans-Europe Express' and a lot of other decent stuff for the non-punks to choose from including those two and Yes, Genesis, Gong Tangerine Dream and Bjork even. Year zero? What year zero? Not much to offer from the punks.
Well...
Celia Cruz? Cui Jian? t.A.T.u? (OK, the last one might not be significant, even if they've sold millions of records).
India's constitution defines it as a socialist democratic republic, and its musical output is huge - Bollywood obviously being one of the world's largest producers of film, most of it music-led - and Bob Marley became a world star under a socialist government in Jamaica.
If you're defining socialist as strict, old-school, non-democratic, Marxist-Leninism, then the pool to choose from is pretty small - about half a dozen countries worldwide - and you're right, we don't get to hear much music on Radio 1 from Laos or the DPRK. But then as I write I'm struggling to name any truly significant acts from Italy or The Netherlands either...
And let's not forget. . .
Los Van Van, Silvio Rodriguez and Pablo Milanés. All three have probably sold millions more records than your Franz Ferndinands could ever dream of.
Or does "significant" mean "on MTV a lot"?
Here's a group from The Netherlands...
... in 1973 there were no mobile phones,so they had to use Radar Love.
Italian prog giants P.F.M.
sorry to take over the socialist party!
Hard to think of music
from many other countries because a lot of their pop is not sung in English so doesn't get known here. Doesn't mean it does not exist and is not hugely significant in it's own country and others. Of course we could find out about it if we could be bothered, but it's hard to find time and there's all the other english sung music to get as well (a music lover's life is so hard) - bit of chauvinism too probably.
Buena Vista Social Club?
OK, they were tools of that disgraceful yankee Ryland Cooder, than of the Cuban State. But, funny that, it nearly killed his career in USA, as they tried to blacklist his pinko ways.
That's, um, pretty socialist action, really, to fight for the release of the music??
Cheers to Ry. You're OK with me, comrade!
You do realise Jazz,Blues
You do realise Jazz,Blues etc,were by-products of slavery don't you?
And its worth pointing out the post war popular culture that we so love evolved in a mixed economy.A true free market wouldn't let an unqualified sixteen year old elvis wannabe doss around art school, taking time off to play hamburg with equipment "borrowed" from the school.
Aside from the
fact that not every nation shares the same sense of 'pop' culture, surely blues, jazz, hippy and punk sprung from Zeus's head as a reaction to the oppression and boredom of capitalism. Thus its influence is malignant if anything as opposed to being some transcendentally magical conduit. Still. I'm merely pleased one of my threads has achieved more than five replies - oh yeah.
and most great soviet art was oppositional too
Aleksandr Isaevich Solzhenitsyn, any one?
Capitalism is just better at allowing it to flourish (and financing it too usually)
Well done, Paul...
... you've made it to 28 comments; my personal best is 25.
But, here's the thing: is it ok to be competitive in the Socialist Party?
29
well done.
and i'm shot down in flames....Celia Cruz, Cui Jian, Los Van Van, Silvio Rodriguez and Pablo Milanés. you can certainly walk into any high street in tokyo, new york, beijing, cleethorpes and hear those ones being played in the equivalent of top shop.
Don't be glib, Dollster, for it doth not become thee
The population of Latin America - where people still buy records - is slightly larger than that of Cleethorpes. Los Van Van have probably sold a lot more records than Kylie. Seriously. Chris Moyles doesn't play them a lot, true, but that doesn't mean they're not out there.
(Celia Cruz was anti-Castro, though. We need to cross her off the list of fallen heroes.)
aah but glib has its own pleasure, mr V
and dont worry, i am going over to amoeba records in a week & i shall purchase one or two of these to try.
that's the power of a free market, of course!
Cui Jian
Has sold 15,000,000 albums, and you're right, you probably won't find him in Top Shop in Cleethorpes, but Beijing, yes: he's China's biggest star.
And it's not completely unlikely you'd get to hear Celia Cruz (sorry Archie) in, say, New York - she regularly headlined Madison Square Gardens.
He shoots.
He scores.
And I'm hung out to dry. That's the trouble with being glib. Still I have helped Paul Holmes achieve a personal best with this thread.