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Simple Minds or U2?

Dave Amitri's picture

I'm off work and should be busy painting ceilings and things but I really can't be arsed. So as Simple Minds were give a bit of a kicking on "The Wosrt Ever" thread yesterday and U2 are roundly dismissed in these parts I thought I would use my time more wisely and ask a completely irrelevant and pointless question. So, in extreme circumstances, for example if the Martians landed and had a particular penchant for pompous, Celtic, stadium rock played with a swagger and some dubious 80's stylings and banned all other music apart from Simple Minds and U2 who would you choose? Me? Simple Minds every time for the wonder that is "New Gold Dream", the intro to "Waterfront" and the sheer bare faced over the topness of "Once Upon A Time".

Simple Minds "Sanctify Yourself"

0

I'll take...

Simple Minds as well, especially this one,

4
humphreym | 16 March 2011 - 11:13am

Both have high points and low

But I have the following four songs on my iPod and I never, ever tire of hearing them: The American, Love Song, I Travel, New Gold Dream (81, 82, 83, 84).

Achtung Baby was one of those rare things: an album with no duff tracks. U2's problem is over-exposure, for good though they are, I need never play One, WOWY, P(ITNOL), WTSHNN ever again cos I will soon hear one of them on the radio.

Both, of course, haven't made a good record for nigh-on 2 decades. Unlike REM.

3
kb | 16 March 2011 - 11:13am

Sounds about right.

You speak the truth my friend.

0
jonnyartist | 16 March 2011 - 12:02pm

U2

HTDAAB is their best record. Bono keeps his gob shut and allows The Edge to lead on an album. (almost) Metal.

But generally Simple Minds were far better, especially in the early days. Still pull together a cracking live show too.

0
Six Dog | 16 March 2011 - 12:08pm

"four songs on my iPod and I

"four songs on my iPod and I never, ever tire of hearing them: The American, Love Song, I Travel, New Gold Dream (81, 82, 83, 84)."

Totally and utterly concur.

Lovely stuff

2
fedoraboy | 16 March 2011 - 12:53pm

Add also

Theme for Great Cities. Cracking instrumental

0
illuminatus | 16 March 2011 - 4:15pm

There's only one way

to find out - FIGHT ! (Actuslly Jim Kerr vs Bono would be pretty entertaining).
Simple Minds for me, loved New Gold Dream as well and shall dig it out later. Thanks Dave. BTW a mate was ents secretary at Exeter Uni a long while back and he had Simple Minds on, said they were superb and nice guys as well. This was before they made it though.

0
Francis Barry-Walsh | 16 March 2011 - 11:14am

Kerr carries a significant weight advantage...

these days. Bono may have the mobility but Kerr has the street smarts. Only one winner.

Kerr - inside 2 rounds.

0
Six Dog | 16 March 2011 - 12:10pm

Clearly it's Simple Minds

They did some bloody good tunes. Decent new wave/synth band and pre-Belfast Child a good run of albums really. I can still tap a toe to their stuff, U2 I find quite unlistenable.

0
Dr Volume | 16 March 2011 - 11:55am

Hmm.

I'd rather be deaf than hear a single note from either of them.

3
JQW | 16 March 2011 - 11:57am

Not sure

Is death an option?

1
fraser_waterfield | 16 March 2011 - 1:48pm

Gotta pick you up on something though Dave

if the Martians landed

If it was in a car park, no-one would care.

3
kb | 16 March 2011 - 11:59am

it's good to talk

Couldn't we persuade the Martians to try listening to some other stuff?

If not, I'd suggest launching a counter-attack led by Bruce Willis, Robert Duvall and Will Smith. That would sort those tasteless Martian bastards out.

0
DC Eisenhower | 16 March 2011 - 12:00pm

No, I like it

First contact, the walkway extends from the spaceship, the gases clear, the Martians emerge and approach the human delegation... Prince Charles steps forward, whips out two plastic rectangles, clears his throat, and says; " New Gold Dream or October?"

That'll show the little green twats.

0
Captain Underpants | 16 March 2011 - 9:31pm
stimpy | 27 March 2011 - 11:11am

Purely

for Johnny Cash and U2 - The Wanderer on Zooropa, they 'edge' it. But for me that is the only redeeming feature for both groups.

1
jimmyshoes01 | 16 March 2011 - 12:15pm

On a good day

I can see where this one is going, so i'll get my two penneth worth in before the mud starts flying.

Both have done good and bad over the years, but on balance Simple Minds for the early years and U2 for the mid period stuff, as amply demonstrated below.

1
jonnyartist | 16 March 2011 - 12:16pm

Tend to agree

For me New Gold Dream was the last time Simple Minds mattered, but having said that most of Sons and Fascination is still top drawer.

As for U2 a big build up, peak at Unforgetable Fire and then long slow tail, never quite awful just not that good.

0
grahamt | 1 April 2011 - 9:46pm

You're all soooooo wrong

The answer is Then Jericho

0
Ahh_Bisto | 16 March 2011 - 1:10pm

As a

Belfast child myself, nothing U2 have done (& I hold no affection for any of their works) is as appalling as the complete desecration of one of the most haunting folk songs of all time as carried out by Johnny & The Self Abusers. No amount of good works can redeem that butt clenchingly awful attempt at 'serious political commentarty'.

3
garyt | 16 March 2011 - 1:17pm

NO!!!

No!!!!!!!!

I had forgetten all about Then Jerico. Now you've reminded me that they existed and that they had a hit record. You bastard.

0
DC Eisenhower | 16 March 2011 - 1:19pm

Hur hur hur

My work here is done.

(slopes off clutching his signed picture of Gary Davies)

1
Ahh_Bisto | 16 March 2011 - 9:10pm

ye gods...

...what to make of Simple Minds? The only way I have ever been able to deal with it is to think of a band making 6 generally brilliant, ground-breaking albums then disbanding and being replaced by some pompous blokes prancing about in pyjamas. 6 good albums ain't a bad career, surely:

1 Life in a Day - Some good moments (Destiny, title track, Murder Story) but too much post Jonny and the Self-Abusers post-glam trash
2 Real to Real Cacophony - Utter genius, music today would be rubbish if this had never happened. Dense, claustrophobic electro with tunes!
3 Empires & Dance - Much sparser, dance sound, brilliant 'concept album' travelogue vibe
4 Sons & Fascination - the masterpiece for me, one of the great albums of the 80s, again extremely influential if you listen to it today
5 Sister Feelings Call - some brilliant moments esp 'Careful in Career' and 'Theme for Great Cities'
6 New Gold Dream - some shimmering genius again (Big Sleep, SomeoneSomewhere, Hunter & the Hunted) though suddenly those stadium rock tendencies starting to show, quick retire to the farm...

Everything after this is by imposters, surely???

3
al renwick | 16 March 2011 - 1:29pm

Bang On

You took the works right out of my mouth Mr Renwick. I put the decline down to the gradual shedding of original members. I think only Kerr & Burchill (Guitar) remained after your timeline stops.

0
Dick Grant | 16 March 2011 - 3:48pm

Michael McNeill and Derek Forbes remained

For Sparkle in the Rain - which isn't bad at all. Mel Gaynor stepped in on drums here.

Forbes dropped out on Once Upon A Time - replaced by John Giblin on bass. Which is where it all went wrong.

Think McNeill remained up to the late 90's but I'd long given up by then.

Comparison drawn with The Stone Roses, where band lose original key members (funky, rolling, smarts drummer with chops and guitar genius) and replace them with competent sessioneers with limited "feel".

edit - sure Forbes rejoined at some point in the not too distant past. Perhaps I still care more than I consciously know!

0
Six Dog | 16 March 2011 - 5:38pm

Sparkle in the rain

Gets lumped in with once upon a time and the stadium years, unfairly I think. Lillywhites production is immense. Listen to 'kick inside of me', they still had it then. Anyway glad the minds are coming out on top here

0
mdavies27 | 16 March 2011 - 7:41pm

I like Sparkle

more now than I did back then. It doesn't seem as bombastic now as it did then, there is more variety than first impressions gave. I think it contains some great tunes and its epic scope in many ways seems more of a genuine swagger than most bands can muster today using studio effects to recreate that.

Friends of mine went to see Simple Minds last year (I think) performing New Gold Dream in its entirety live. They went with a couple who knew of the band only in terms of Don't You Forget About Me and those subsequent weaker singles. They were converted within the first song of New Gold Dream.

I still think that album's their best effort. It has a wonderful sound and ambience to it, quite unlike any album I own and Jim Kerr's* vocals work so well in that musical setting.

*Or Juan Kerr to use his Spanish moniker as NME once printed

0
Ahh_Bisto | 16 March 2011 - 9:20pm

Forbes

Listening to their early stuff, what really stands out for me are the basslines. Once Derek Forbes left, Simple Minds lost something that made them great.

2
Philip Stout | 17 March 2011 - 3:07pm

"pompous, Celtic, stadium

"pompous, Celtic, stadium rock played with a swagger and some dubious 80's stylings "

That's Big Country, that is. Or The Alarm.
The correct answer is, of course, BC.

0
sitheref2409 | 16 March 2011 - 1:40pm

Big Country??? Pompous??

Surely some mistake!

You're not thinking of The Waterboys are you?

0
Six Dog | 16 March 2011 - 5:40pm

I'm a big Big Country fan.

I'm a big Big Country fan. Seen them several times, have most of the albums.

But seriously: Peace in Our Time? Thirteen valleys? A bit, um, well, pompous perhaps?

0
sitheref2409 | 16 March 2011 - 7:06pm

Simple Minds

particularly back when they were doing scary robot goth disco

0
simonperrins | 16 March 2011 - 2:13pm

bally eric classic

1
gaz | 16 March 2011 - 4:08pm

Early Simple Minds for Me Please

(And you may be interested to know that the early stuff is available very cheap from Amazon downloads:

Life In A Day - £3.99
Real To Real Cacophony - £4.99
Empires & Dance - £2.99
Sons & Fascination / Sister Feelings Call - £5.49
New Gold Dream - £2.99
Sparkle In The Rain - £2.99
Once Upon A Time - £3.89

If you've not heard New Gold Dream I'd suggest you give it a try, especially at a price that's less than a pint would cost you.)

1
Red Umpire | 16 March 2011 - 5:14pm

I actually own a simple

I actually own a simple minds record, the one with sanctify on, and for a while I quite liked them. U2 I have never cared for, but if aliens did land Bono would, no doubt, be the first to go and press the flesh. We all know what would happen then.

0
woodface | 16 March 2011 - 8:05pm

Simple minds

Saw them a couple of years ago playing a town square sort of festival thing(go for the days you want, go home to your own bed)

They were super fun, a few drinks and a singalong didn't hurt anybody. I'd completely forgotten they did "Someone, Somewhere in summertime" also, which was a fantastic surprise.

Lemmeseeyerhands!!

0
Jon Whitney | 16 March 2011 - 8:33pm

If push came to shove, as it often does

I'd probably go for U2 as they just have more individual tracks I like, and less I skip over.

However, I feel the need to lob these two SM tracks up, just to prove it wasn't all pretentious angularity. Sometimes it was bloody good hooks and fantastic drums.

0
Harold Holt | 17 March 2011 - 8:43am

Punk Goth Futurist New Wave Stadium Rock

As with most bands I liked as a teenager, I went through a pretty obsessive Simple Minds phase, and attacked various record fairs looking for alternate tracks on 12" singles and, more excitingly, bootlegs.

Listening to them in their different eras, it became clear that they did what very few other bands have done, which is rework or rearrange older songs to fit in alongside their most recent stuff. When touring Empires & Dance, everything took on the stark, robotic qualities of that album. A year later, touring Sons & Fascination the songs got looser and (dare I say it) funkier.

The entire New Gold Dream show had a warmer, more lush feel as was appropriate to the album, and when Sparkle In The Rain came around everything got loud and clattery, and Jim Kerr shouted all the way through The American.

Finally, on the Once Upon A Time tour, everything gets slower and that bit more pompous sounding (and weirdly quasi religious). That's not necessarily a bad thing - I don't like that record but the versions of East at Easter and Book Of Brilliant Things are great - totally different from their album versions. In fact there's a live version of Celebrate (off Empires) that is kind of disastrous but fascinating - taking a clanking bleepy droney chant and making it into a massive, emotive stadium rock ANTHEM is the very definition of trying to smash square blocks through round holes.

I don't know how much they did this after this point as I kind of lost interest in the band*. But the bits I did hear they seemed to be actively rewriting their old stuff. Ghostdancing is a "rock" version of I Travel, Mandela Day is de-synthed Seeing Out The Angel, and I'm sure later albums had thinly veiled rewrites of Waterfront, The American and Theme For Great Cities. If you're gonna steal, stel from yourself, eh?

* even though I think Street Fighting Years had some good bits

1
simonperrins | 17 March 2011 - 2:56pm

U2

To my ears, Simple Minds started off well and went downhill fast. It didn't help that they kept writing the same song over and over and over again. I'm afraid, for me, their canon is an example of the Law Of Diminishing Returns (And Chords).

U2, on the other hand, started off badly but got better and better as their ability started to match their ambition. And they tried to stretch themselves, do new things, experiment and generally develop.

Both bands have some real clunkers in the cupboard but for me, there's much more good U2 and the best U2 easily trumps the best Simple Minds.

2
Mark JF | 17 March 2011 - 3:15pm

All in the bass lines

Empires and Dance and Sons and Fascination are really great albums. Hard to believe that the band that recorded Love Song and This Fear Of Gods could be churning out Sanctify Yourself a few short years later. Early Simple Minds were fantastic and that's in large part due to the presence of Derek Forbes- a very interesting bass player. Once he left he seemed to take the most exciting, driving and unusual part of the band with him. Contrast Mr Forbes with Adam Clayton who is the most laziest and dullest bassist alive. So Simple Minds win.

Mind you, you should probably view my opinions with suspicion as I rate October- universally maligned by everyone including U2- at least on that record Clayton could be bothered to play something a little different than root notes.

0
mwng | 26 March 2011 - 3:04pm
Dr Volume | 27 March 2011 - 3:49am

I missed early Simple Minds, so can't write with any authority.

The elder brothers of friends had New Gold Dream / Sparkle In The Rain, and I really liked them, but didn't consider it to be 'my' music. I think 'Alive and Kicking' is a good track. But for me, this is the one (the one they didn't write):

(Alright, I'm a man of certain age... and The Breakfast Club meant something back then... :-))

I think my U2 fandom is pretty well documented in WordWorld, and I always stick-up for Bono and the boys.

I love everything from The Joshua Tree, through to How To Dismantle An Atomic Bomb. No Line On The Horizon is OK, but has failed to grab me in a big way. The top of the mountain for me is Achtung Baby / Zooropa, but that might be for personal reasons - mind you that's the only way to respond to music, isn't it?


Goosebumps.

0
Adman | 27 March 2011 - 8:22am

THEY ARE BOTH AWFUL

Horrible, pompous, boring, ridiculously hyped

Sorry, but why would I want to listen to them,?

No idea about bass and drums being vaguely funky, no idea about a decent tune, no idea about interesting chords or harmonies, no idea about humour or irony or not taking themselves seriously.

0
Mousey | 27 March 2011 - 9:40am

I like to think I've got a reasonably subtle grasp of music.

Sure there is a place for funky; but not all the time, not for me. And when music is so funky that it becomes 'funk,' then, well, forget it. Yawn.

You don't think 'One' is a decent tune? Or 'Stuck In A Moment...' or 'Stay' ? Well, OK, that's up to you - but there are tunes there. Good ones to these ears. (Perhaps they are made of tin.)

Harmonies? I think Edge, aside from his unique guitar playing, is U2's secret weapon in terms of vocal harmonies. Maybe not 'interesting' - but effective. If I want 'interesting' I'll listen to Pet Sounds, or somesuch. And frankly for me, pop music sometimes gets so interesting that it disappears up its own fundament.

U2 are po-faced, yes. But their best period musically and artistically (for me) is when they started to play with that, and subvert it. Achtung, Zooropa, Pop. Outsized silver cowboy hats, Mephisto, flying Trabants, all that - it was tongue in cheek. Humorous. Ironic. I absolutely loved U2 then. Alright, that playfulness has disappeared lately, and I think they are diminished for that - but it was there. That's the band I have in mind when I stick up for them; they helped me through some pretty shoddy times.

Finally - no offence meant Mousey - it's all totally subjective - I respect your view. :-)

Bono and Edge's best tune?

Roy Orbison - 'Mystery Girl'

1
Adman | 27 March 2011 - 11:13am

rock and a hard place

I'm sure someone else (probably everyone) has said this but can I have neither. There is nothing by U2 that I actively dislike (although I Will Follow on Boy is a belter). And I must admit to liking one or two pieces by S Minds. That was during my 1980s "wear a jacket with the sleeves rolled up" phase.

Can we make it a triple header and add in the Eurythmics? The GLW's entire record collection consists of U2,S Minds and everything ever recorded by A Lennox. Is that grounds for divorce?

0
cradlerock | 27 March 2011 - 10:04am

Early Simple Minds

beats U2 hands down.

But neither can hold a candle to The Waterboys in their big music pomp circa Pagan Place and This Is The Sea.

0
Johan | 27 March 2011 - 11:02am

Ah yes but could ver Minds have ever produced 'Rattle & Hum'?

(and you can read that any way you choose!)

0
stimpy | 27 March 2011 - 11:19am

I think they could......

Ropey cover versions, rootsy earnest numbers, loud shouty numbers, navel gazing, overproduction and some grade A killer tunes all present and correct.

0
Six Dog | 30 March 2011 - 11:48am

Street Fighting Years...

... both rattles and hums sadly.

0
ganglesprocket | 30 March 2011 - 11:50am

Graffiti Soul

Simple Minds for me have an unfair press from those on their high horse about 80's Pop/Rock. Anyone who sticks around for a while has phases which aren't everyone's cup of tea. Look to 2009's Graffiti Soul for a band making something as good as anything else kicking around in that genre. Still a top live act and touring regularly.

0
Hip Priest | 1 April 2011 - 8:47pm

Two huge groups

from the UK (well, kinda), both with their roots in post punk...they can't be all bad.
Simple Minds missed a trick by not copying U2's irony phase when they became so big. It got them out of a big mess. That said, Someone, Somewhere in Summertime is one of my all time favourite songs by anyone.
Prefer Big Country to both though, desperately sad Stuart couldn't have stayed around and reinvented himself and the band. There was so much warmth towards them.

0
Mr Fade | 1 April 2011 - 9:56pm
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