Entertainment For Lively Minds
Records you'd play to convince somebody that so-and-so isn't shite
Posted by Patrick Crowther on 7 August 2010 - 8:42pm.
You know, the artistes that the Taste Police have deemed to be naff, uncool, the nadir of music, unmitigated horseshit.. that kind of thing. But you know better, and you have proof...
I shall start with Phil Collins and his splendid tune I Missed Again.
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Most of 'Face Value'
is pretty good... it went downhill fast with Phil's 2nd album though..
I particularly like 'Hand in Hand' (not just because it is almost totally instrumental).
Bollocks
He's shite. He sings like he's constipated.
What's wrong with...
that?
He also murdered ...
... one of my favourite Motown songs and completely devalued it
Lead singer : No. Backing singer : Yes. Drummer : Oh Yes
I have a soft side for his work on John Martyn's "Grace and Danger" album.
Good work on Eno's "Another Green World" too.
The cheery scamp from Oliver routine might grate, contrasting with reports of charmlessness elsewhere, but he has still been on some fine records. One or two were even his own.
Crime against music
What I don't get is why shite DJs still play Collins' whiny abomination at weddings etc when the original was, and probably always will be, the only one to consider. For that track alone I think PC should never be re-evaluated and he has far more crimes of music to be taken into account. File under Cher.
Yep its bollocks alrighty
Yes Uncle Phil always sounded like utter gnats urine to me too. Something so 'M&S slippers, comfortable flat in E14' about it. Lets face it, what has to happen to CHOOSE to put a horn section like that on a record.
Alternatively, play 'em some Brand X
Arguably Phil's finest work.
No argument about it...
... the great man's finest moments were with Brand X - but then he was always a drummer who sang a bit, rather than the other way round (in our house, anyway)...
Just happened to pull out my sixish..
Brand x albums recently and had to admit they haven't aged well, apart from Moroccan Roll, maybe because it's actually got some melodies on there, which is hardly the case with the other albums.
That man Percy Jones on bass though, lovely way of nudging the music forward. Way to go Stimpy.
Yes, and if they want to hear some more of Phil's finest,
... they could lend an ear to the drums on the live version of "Dancing with the Moonlit Knight" on Disc 3 of the first Genesis archive box set. An absolute humdinger.
This might not work
but would be the choices to convince anyone Hot Chocolate was so much more than 'You Sexy Thing'
Brother Louie
I'll Put You Together Again
No convincing required
in this parish.
perhaps those of us that first heard them in 1982
...might need more convincing...(still this video makes me chortle to this day and there's an arrow for anyone who can tell me the exact name of the street where this was filmed?)
Apple with chocolate
Hot Chocolate's first 45 was in '69 and on Apple and was a version of 'Give Peace A Chance'.
It might not sound too exciting but Brian Matthew played it about three months ago and it's sensational.
It should make an appearance in the upcoming 'Best of Apple' compilation.
Bruce Springsteen
erm, erm oh forget it.
Bruce Springsteen
I play them this. Every time. Christ, this is the third time I've posted it on this site. They may not like it but it will change their perception a little bit. Usually.
http://open.spotify.com/track/3oSJWbB3SXWOexcWGX63bQ
Thanks but
I really just don't get it. I have posted numerous times about my Springsteen blindness and had many suggestions of tracks that would change my mind, which I really appreciate, but he's just not for me (so far). I listen to all music with an open mind and really hope that one day something clicks and I can go back and enjoy his back catalogue but I'm still waiting. Mind you, I had the same thing with The Smiths in the 80s, and then I heard Girlfriend In A Coma and got everything and my love of The Smiths lives on. Thanks Lucas for your time (and patience with me)for posting this.
No, thank you
Sorry to go on about it *again*. I just know that I resisted Springsteen for years and now count him in my top few.
I love the politeness and open-mindedness on this site. In the words of Jack White, I've said it once before but it bears repeating.
"Big statements" ahead
I've never got Springsteen either. Best thing I ever heard from the old Gum Chewer is that song The River, which at least has some kind of genuine soul to it. But even then all that flowery piano, and his self conscious vocal just wrecks it. Something so Ham Fisted about it all.
Born in the USA is just a terrible song, so plodding in its rhythm, and blindingly obvious in its melody. Inspiring no, sickening yes. There ya go
Marky:
Do me a favour and listen to the Spotify link I've posted above. Curious to hear what you think.
A "cool rocking daddy" hmmm
Ok, well I'll give you, thats a little better than that interminable, plodding, ham fisted final version that everyone knows.
But among the many things I can't get over are lyrics like "…to go and kill the yellow man". Now, regardless of context, I mean "yellow man"! And "I'm a cool rocking Daddy" - I mean its just paralysingly crude isn't it?
First day back from my holiday
and you serve up one of my pet subjects. Some people deny themselves the chance of hearing something they may enjoy because of the "uncool" thing. My obvious ones are "Love Games" or "Chinese Way" by Level 42, the whole of "Pelican West" by Haircut 100. Your Phil Collins offering is wonderful, I still remember the time it was OK to like Phil, Mick Hucknall is another, everyone loved "Holding Back The Years" but then denied themselves some other great music because they found out Hucknall is a ginger, arrogant, hedonistic, dickhead but man oh man can he sing.I love this site for many reasons one of which is that my ears have been opened to a whole previously unheard world, but I will not stop enjoying what I enjoy because others think they're shite.
Good holiday, Dave?
Welcome back. You know Patrick only started this thread so you could post some Justin Currie vids..
And Hot Water is still my favourite Level 42 song.
For a bit of Amitri / Law crossover..
Bit of slap at 2:20 but it doesn't come over so well on small lappie speakers.
Not bad at all Lenny
I just wish I had another week off work.
JC was too obvious, even for me.
Simply Wrong
I thought Simply Red were always Radio 2 territory. I disliked them from the start as a result of the appalling cover of Money's Too Tight To Mention. It was a long time before I realised Hucknall was a bit of a dick because I simply didn't care and was rather hoping he would just go away.
I think you're right about Haircut 100, I don't think any dislike is down to the music but the perception of the band due to the way they were marketed. I don't think they're a huge step away from Orange Juice in pop music terms but they don't tend to be seen like that.
What is "Radio 2 territory"?
Seems a pretty broad church to dismiss, John.
What is "Radio 2 territory"
and does that include Mark Radcliffe and Stuart Maconie?
1982
I was referring to Radio 2 territory in 1982. It's still not a station for me but it's changed a lot since then.
Completely agree...
...about Mucknall. I've taken some stick a time or two defending 'Holding Back The Years'. Whatever you think of his later works or the man himself (I'm a fan of neither), 'Holding Back..' is a solid gold classic by anyone's standards.
I would also say the same about this other white boy soul classic
Phil Cool
Sorry Patrick, but songs like I Missed Again are the reason why PC albums remained on the shelves when I browsed in record shops.
However, the Genesis material from that time seemed a bit more adventurous (Mama, Land of Confusion, I Can't Dance) and somehow more likeable than the solo stuff. So I won't dismiss Phil Collins absolutely - he is not the antichrist that he is sometimes portrayed as.
Take That
Yes really. One of the greatest pop records ever recorded by anyone - ever.
You might be right there, Paul.
And possibly understood as well.
You could add...
...A Million Love Songs, Never Forget, Babe, Pray and a good few more, including that recent one whose name escapes me. I won't hear a word against ver Vat. As a pure pop group, they're pretty unassailable IMO.
Take That.
I am more or less with you on take that, but I prefer the Man band version more than the boy band.
Also, I cant stand RW doing angels, but I loved Millenium.
The recent one:
Is it this?
Tremendous record - proper grown up pop music.
That's the badger.
A great song.
But,but,but......that line
But,but,but......that line "in the twist of separation, you excelled at being free" consigns it to the 'Live and Let Die' pile of great songs that I just can't enjoy because of a clumsy lyric. My loss, I guess, because other than that it truly is a bloody marvellous pop record.
erm sorry?
...but in a song that boasts the line:
"Got a fist of pure emotion"...?
The guitar tutor's current favourite.........
In my day it was all House of the Rising son, these days its Back for Good
Depeche Mode - One Caress
Included here purely because it is the only song of theirs that my GLW likes because it sounds nothing like any of the others.
Funnily one of my ex's was converted...
...to DM by this self same tune (along with its parent album - Songs of Faith and Devotion).
While we were an item, around the time of Violator, I was obsessed with Depeche Mode, but she was having none of it.
Years later we were reunited and she revealed a new found love of the band established through this song. I quite like it but apart from the singles, I've always found the rest of Songs of Faith to be quite weak.
I recently went to a DM gig and there were, admittedly very few women in attendance, although I think they have a stronger female following in Europe and the States.
My choice for converting people would be Never Let Me Down simply because it is immeasurably brilliant (and I suspect that the post 90s pop fan might be more receptive to it than the pop fan of 1987)
Sorry - no promo on youtube but it always worked well live...
Agree with you all the way on NLMDA
I chose One Caress because on first listen it isn't obviously them and it's quite tuneful and pretty. Also, an alarmingly good video considering it was not released as a single. Presumably an Anton Corbijn job.
Those that don't like Depeche Mode will probably not be attracted to NMDLA's full enormo-synth experience and Gahan's voice. But it is in my own, personal top 5 of Depeche Mode songs.
I think...
...Enjoy The Silence would probably be my DM track of choice to convert the unconvinced. It's perfect.
Ooh, not sure about that number though
unless trying to convince a fan of oveproduced, bad soul music that Phil Collins can do it too.
If I was to make a case to redeem Phil Collins for his involvement with 'Another Day in Paradise' I would trot out the usual factoids about him rubbing shoulders with John Martyn, Eno, John Cale and suggest this as my Collins Corker:
A Midge Too Far?
Forget the unfortunate name. Forget the era-defining, scalpel-sharp sideburns. Forget his readiness to play Geldof's very own Andrew Ridgeley at Live Aid. Midge Ure is blessed with one of the great pop voices. As both a tunesmith and guitar player he's in a different league from Elvis Costello, Paul Weller or any of his other officially cooler contemporaries. And his contribution to The Canon goes way beyond that jobby about Leonard Rossiter's cat - like this (Spotify link for the iPhone impaired):
So, let's take stock: a proper melody, a proper singalongadothewashingup hook, some apt and highly effective gasping-for-breath vocal phrasing, a non-by-numbers arrangement (a mandolin with a house-music-style filter whapped on it? Ooh, that'll do nicely), and even a nifty nod to "Sugar Sugar" at the end. What more could you possibly ask for?
Undoubtedly
Responsible for many very fine moments. Fade to Grey, Hymn, The Voice, Sleepwalk and many more - but also an excellent "fourth wall" moment in Love's Great Adventure video when he stops the music to get his breath back.
One minor quibble, though. In this video for Breathe, he is throwing playing cards into a top hat. Beyond wistful pop videos, does anyone really do that?
You gotta love a man
who keeps his childhood nickname into his late 50s 8-}
For his rocking credibility may I suggest his membership of Thin Lizzy and a co-writing credit on the theme to Top Of The Pops.
Phil Lynott - Yellow Pearl
I like this idea, Patrick.
But the cynic in me says... pointless game.
How many times have I smiled politely whilst some berk plays me a James Blunt track and says... 'Yeah, but I think you'll really like this one...'
Will I f*ck?!
However, since it's you Mr. Crowther, I'll play.
If people refuse to 'get' my beloved Pixies I say... start acoustic!
Sorry, just re-read the post and got the 'taste police' bit... Obviously the Pixies are cool... but I struggle to find fellow travellers - can they stay?
He became terminally uncool
But he had two or three cracking singles early on. For me, this wonderful song was the best of them:
Wrong priorities
If Gilbert's management had spent more time creating a rock audience friendly name and less time on that ridiculous garb, which was never going to impress anybody, he might still be around now selling shedloads of records (or terabytes of downloads).
Nothing Rhymed
A superbly constructed song and I totally agree about then image thing. It turned me off of him straight away being a 'serious' music fan but now I'm older and grown up, I can really appreciate his song craft.
The clean cut preppy image
that replaced the urchin look was even less appealing to me.
And the fact that he shared the same manager as Tom Jones and Englebert never really computed, either.
Gordon Mills
Gordon Mills appears to have have exerted quite a lot of artistic control over O'Sullivan and was quite happy to use his protégé as a babysitter too, inspiring "Uncle Ray's" song Clair. He didn't really do Tom Jones any favours either as Tom Jones' son appears to have done more to save him from being tired and clichéd both as a singer and by encouraging him to write his own material.
I never knew
that Michael Owen played the piano...
Alone again naturally - bleaker than Joy division.
Unfortunately
he pulled his hamstring five minutes after that photo was taken and was out for six weeks.
A Gilbert O'Sullivan
best of on Amazon is nearly 50 quid, which is a shame, so many great songs. It would be great if he could re-invent himself and get the critical acclaim he really deserves. "Nothing Rhymed" is almost perfect.
Play.com
have it for £20.
Noted
thanks
At the risk of being ostracised...
this has always been one of my favourite songs - by anyone. I know he keeps us amused (but I feel he's being used?)but he did make a few decent records. Now, where's that lute.
Fields of tosh
People often point to this song as an example of the man's songwriting prowess but I can't abide the thing. It's rather poncey if you ask me. If I were to try to show he's not all bad I'd pick something like 'If You Love Somebody Set Them Free' - that's where the man excels, with a bit of an uptempo pop ditty, as was the case in his old band. Actually, to be honest, apart from that and certain highlights from The Police I do stuggle somewhat to think of anything else decent. Each to their own and all that.
Dear god
not that one. Clean pair of heels as soon as that comes on. Surely anything by the Police tops that, even De Doo Doo Doo
Sting = Pompous Twat
File under Bono
Yep
I've always really liked this song, principally because it's so unlike the almighty tat he usually produces (Let Your Soul be Your Pilot is one of the worst songs I've ever heard). Fields of Gold has suffered due to too much radio play/X Factor covering, but it's still very evocative.
Sting is worth, even at a very conservative estimate, at least £30 mill; not bad for someone who's written 5 good songs - at best.
Did anyone ever hear his awful tune called Brand New Day? Have a listen, as it sounds just like the theme from the Adams Family.
All This Time…
…has always been my fave Stinlge
It sounds like it could have been on Synchronicity though sadly the rest of Soul Cages didn’t
Billy Joel Goodnight Saigon
Great choice...
but you could have chosen about 20 other great tunes from the JTWYAH.
I spent many a happy hour
I spent many a happy hour with a transistor radio tuned to Radio Caroline (in 70s form) while they rotated "Piano Man" - a great song but to me it's an "exception to the rule" paradigm.
Pretty certain this is not cool but
ya boo sucks! I like it.
This is a great pop song.
Manics.
Small Black Flowers That Grow In The Sky is how I answer anyone who says the Manics never had it.
Marillion...
Sorry, can't help you post-Fish
Has to be OMD...
...a truly majestic tune on a par with Joy Division's Atmosphere
Surely better ....
.... in their post industrial early pomp. How strange does this look now?
Back when they were good, I often made a case for UB40
Fuelled with anger, ire and vicious social commentary - along with The Specials, UB40 introduced a gaggle of early 80's youth into the world of politics...From Signing Off through to UB44 and Jeffrey Morgan, their star shined brightly. They got lazy and rich. Or rich and lazy.....not sure which way round.
In their pomp though.........great band.
Yoko Ono
Definitely "Mind Train"
Or "Yang Yang"
If they don't like it already
why force them?
I actually went out and bought this
on a single new and at full price in 1971.
It's still my only Streisand record, but Babs handles it well and perhaps even betters the Laura Nyro original?