Entertainment For Lively Minds
Re Luis Suarez/Patrice Evra
Posted by Roy Levy on 20 October 2011 - 5:01pm.
Can I just make the observation that on the whole people tend not to complain of having been the victim of racist abuse unless it's true.
That is all.
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Whoever is guilty
should be banned for a very very long time.
That is all.
You have a more trusting nature
Than I
Absent evidence, I wouldn't take anyone's word for anything
The no smoke without fire rule
is not totally reliable.
People also tend
to not tumble theatrically to the ground unless fouled.
Sadly, nothing can be taken for granted on the football pitches of the 21st century. Apart from the brilliance of Leo Messi (see other thread).
Excuse me!
I think we could ask Jack Rodwell about people's tendency to fall to the ground theatrically when not fouled and get his opinion.
Or we can just check the video evidence.
EFC
Rodwell shouldn't have gone. It wasn't a foul. However, he did still clatter into Suarez at speed which would a) knock you over and b) hurt. It was the ref's error, not Suarez's.
LFC
Spartacus, fellow redman (iirc), I disagree. It was a foul.
Was never a sending off though. Probably not a yellow card. Deeply unfair. And consequently rather funny. But if I was a toffeman I'd be spitting tacks.
Brilliant,yes
but diving and this also
familiar technique
they must teach that at Argie football school
many a true word,Nick
United fan are you?
I've no idea who is lying and neither do you. All we can hope is that justice is done.
I'm a United fan
I hope it is true because if it isn't then Evra is out of order and there is nothing worse than crying wolf over a serious issue, and definately not because the other bloke plays for Liverpool. (Who for the record I bear no malice towards - apart for 180 minutes a year)
Likewise
I'm a Liverpool supporter and I hope it *isn't* true, because it'd be embarrassing. But I'm not going to leap to Suarez's defence just because he wears our shirt. I've no idea if he did it, but if he's guilty he deserves to be punished.
Sorry but due to personal experience
it's not always true. I would love to think that it was true. I don't however know anything re the subject matter you refer to.
I'll fill you in
Following Saturday's game between Manchester United and Liverpool Patrice Evra accused Luis Suarez, with whom he'd had a running feud during the game, of calling him a racist word at least 10 times. Suarez denies this.
I won't tell you who plays for whom because it's irrelevant. I just hope whoever's lying is suitably punished.
Thanks
I should have googled it and checked it out but I reacted due to a fairly recent experience. As football is supposed to be pro actively non racist the issue should be dealt with appropriately.
I would question
how much linguistic understanding there can be between an Uruguayan and Frenchman in a noisy Anfield, however I cannot believe that Evra would make something like this up. Both players though have previous, I believe and would be interested to see what the outcome is.
Previous?
In Evra's case, you mean when he accused a Chelsea groundsman a few years ago? I don't think that would influence my view of whether what he has accused Suarez of is true or not. Maybe he just complains about racist abuse more than some others who just figure it's not worth the aggravation to highlight it.
And good luck to him for doing so. If it's proven I hope they throw the book at Suarez.
Evra does not have previous
There have been two cases where Evra has been involved with claims of racism. Once was the Chelsea groundsman, who was accused of two of the Manchester United staff of racism where Evra, I believe, said he had heard nothing. The other was a case of another opposition player (can't remember who) who was accused by lipreading members of the crowd of the same thing. In this case I believe Evra denied he had heard anything.
There was an excellent post on one of the United blogs where the history of Evra was summed up, and where the author also said you can see in the reaction of the two sets of fans who they want to believe.
The last thing hit home with me, because I remember an incident between Ian Wright and Peter Schmeichel where I absolutely refused to believe Ian Wright. But I am a fan of United.
Congratulations
You have just completely ignored one of the fundamental protections of the English justice system, the presumption that someone is innocent until proven guilty.
You can't sell papers
or stir up thousands on that basis!!!
Accept that point..
.. but if the case isn't proven - doesn't means he isn't guilty.
As a previous poster said ^ this is the 1st time Evra has come out and accused anyone of this - all other incidents were publicised by someone else.
Doesn't matter which team you support, anyone who saw the game will know that something serious went on during the game. Just surprising that Evra didn't raise it with the ref when he had both players together for a bollocking.
You clearly don't accept the point
Or you wouldn't have followed it up with all that innuendo.
If Suarez played for Man United and Evra for Liverpool, you'd be supporting Suarez. You seem like that sort of fan - always stinking up football threads with childish ABU stuff.
Nonsense.
Couldn't care less which each player plays for. The issue is a much bigger than individual rivalries.
I'll leave the rest of it unanswered as you are clearly the beacon of well reasoned debate on here. Are you hoping for a rosette this year ?
As a word of advice - I wouldn't assume anything - things make a habit of biting you on the arse later in life.
Evra
I wouldn't believe a word he said. Suarez, as another poster said, is innocent until proved guilty. Evra seems a particularly objectionable character e.g. his behaviour at the last world cup.
World Cup
Evra was indeed a total cockwomble at the world cup.
But then so was Suarez for different reasons.
In fact, the only two things I can be sure of is that both men are fantastically-gifted footballers and Grade-A bellends.
Martina Hyde's take on it...
...from today's Guardian is here.
A taster:
I'm not taking sides
in this issue, as it's a 'he said, he said' kind of thing, but I will say that I feel very uncomfortable about a situation in which, because a party 'feels' another party has been racist towards them, that party is judged to have a case.
I've tentatively raised this on here before, but you're just as injured / maimed / dead as a victim of inter-estate violence, inter-family violence, dysfunctional relationship violence, fall-out-of-business-dealings-violence, random-walking-through-the-wrong-part-of-town violence, wearing-the-wrong-football-colours violence, etc. as you are from 'racist' violence.
In any of the above cases, how robust would the defence of 'it is my belief that he was disrespecting me, therefore, legally, he was' be?
What is sure is that the obnoxious.....
.....Liverpool/Man. Utd. rivalry is alive and kicking, it's merely taken a brief respite away from dis-respecting the dead and injured of Munich and Hillsborough for a season or two.
Still, at least it was a good game......NOT!
last
30 minutes was pretty good. Up until then it was very poor.