Entertainment For Lively Minds
Our Friends in the North - Gritty masterpiece or just a load of bad wigs?
In the 'Bad Actors' thread below, I mentioned 'Our Friends in the North', essentially defending Daniel Craig's ability to act. Leaving that to one side, I was slightly surprised by the 'meh' response to the series from Retro Man and Five-Centres, two posters whose opinions I generally hold in high regard.
For my part, I believe that OFITN is one of the finest British drama series of the last 25 years, up there with the likes of Boys From the Blackstuff, The Singing Detective, Cracker, Prime Suspect and any other, similar series you can name.
I also thought that was the 'accepted critical wisdom', if you will.
Now admittedly, I do like my dramas to be Northern and Gritty, and I did grow up (in the North) through all the events that the series portrays, so maybe the series resonates for me more than for others. I dunno.
But leaving the context (and the bad wigs) to one side, I thought the acting - not just from the four main characters, but also (and especially) from the likes of Peter Vaughan, Nicky's dad who suffered from Alzheimer's - was of the highest quality.
Now I know that tastes differ, and I'm certainly not looking for 'validation' of my own opinion here, I was just surprised at the less than lukewarm response to my comment.
So - what is the view of the Massive? Masterpiece or Meh? Is it a 'Northern' thing?
And what are the other great British (not American - we know what they are) drama series of the last twenty-odd years?
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I loved OFITN.
Yes, there were a couple of poor wigs, but the acting was top notch. It was a difficult thing to take on also, going from age 17/18 to mid forties with the same bunch of actors. Maybe it was of its time, Paul, and only old codgers like ourselves enjoyed it!
See also GBH with the peerless Robert Lindsay and Michael Palin. Great Stuff.
Friends
I borrowed the DVD box set of it earlier in the year and was gripped from start to finish, one of the best series I've watched all year apart from Lost and Flight Of The Concordes, the latter of which I've just discovered.
Sorry Paul
for being flippant - I did say I hadn't seen it as I was put off by the comedy stick-on moustaches and bad wigs.
However, I'd be interested to read some comments about the series and maybe I'll give it a try as I'm hard pushed to think of any really decent British dramas off the top of my head...apart from the ones you mentioned maybe "I, Claudius"?
Do things like Minder, Cold Feet, Auf Weidersehen Pet count?
Flippancy is a good thing
And should be encouraged at all times.
Give it a go - if the Poulson scandal, corruption in the Met and the Miners' Strike are of any interest to you, it's worth the price of admission.
Oh, and Daniel Craig really is pretty good in it...
It was a great series
I watched it on DVD boxset a couple of years ago and thought it was excellent. A really good concept of following a series of friends through three decades.
I'm a soft Southerner but really appreciated it as an excellent piece of drama and with some good acting.
Agreed...
Mark Strong's wigs could have won a BAFTA of their own. His Beatle wig had me proper fooled.
As a piece of drama
...I don't really think it's any better or worse than the others you mention. It was touted at the time as being a groundbreaking, eon-stretching, multi-layered, multi-episode tour de force the likes of which we'd never seen before. Which may have been true.
I did watch it and enjoy it, but I never thought it was the masterpiece everyone made it out to be. Gina McKee's cold as ice in everything, beautiful as she is.
Of course it's been much-imitated since and has passed into kind of legendary status and so has become a bit of a sacred cow. The left-leaning tone and social history elements helped elevate it above criticism too.
I've not seen it since and wondered if it would stand up to a repeat viewing or whether it would be no more of a classic than Clocking Off.
As to you valuing my opinion, I'm totally flattered!
I loved it
Watched it first time (and not since) and we were glued. And yes Gina McGee was 'the one most likely' on that prog, even though Daniel Craig was also top notch.
I did love Clocking Off too, and The Street. I must be one of the few who see that guy off Life On Mars as really the factory manager from Clocking Off.
I suggest
Life On Mars - must be a candidate
Definitely agree with that...
a brilliant show with a great concept, but is it really a drama as such? If so than I would push my case for shows like Minder and Auf Weidersehen Pet - I know they are often classed as comedies but the characters, scripts, situations and acting were so great.
With those shows you got more of a feeling of reality as life does have a lot of humour and banter in it - drama doesn't only have to be dull and worthy.
And I support
Minder & Auf Weidersehen Pet wholly and without question.
Superb.
My votes
State of Play
and if it's not too long ago...
Edge of Darkness
+1
For Edge of Darkness. Tour de force on every front, including Old Uncle Eric's music, with the hard-fought honours going to leads Bob Peck and Joe Don Baker.
Loved the Singing Detective, too. The thing with Dennis Potter is that as I saw more of his stuff my admiration paled slightly - began to think he was grinding the same axe too much and it was making his palms a bit sweaty...
Superb mix of personal and political
Paul, you're right about Our Friends... I watched it last year for the first time since it was shown on TV and it was as good as I remembered it.
I can't think of any other series which mixes the personal and political so effectively. The stories of the four main characters are compelling, especially as they are all flawed, and the range of political events covered over the years is astonishing. Yet you never feel writer Peter Flannery has to include something like the miners strike for the sake of it. The events shape the characters' lives and the characters have an impact on events.
The acting is superb, right down the cast, but especially Christopher Eccleston.
Blackstuff and Bob and Rose are my other favourities from the last 20-odd years.
OFITN
I'm a southerner. Watched it when broadcast, then in my 20s. Loved it. You could tell then that Ecclestone & Craig were ones to watch. Would love to see it again. Might blow my Amazon voucher on it...
Great stuff
As I remember it.
Would like to see AFITN again
to see if it as good as I thought it was at the time.
Well written and superbly acted, deserves the praise it got at the time.
Good shout for Blackstuff - fantastic series which totally nailed early 80's Britain.
Boys From The Blackstuff
A fine series, but the Play For Today, 'The Black Stuff' from which it was spun off had more of an impact on me on original broadcast.
Mind you, 'The Boys...' had the lovely line when Yosser visits the priest:
"Call me Dan, Yosser"
"I'm Desperate, Dan"
boom and, indeed, tish.
AFITN
is the only work of british drama that comes close to The Wire in terms of being a realistic and gritty discussion of the death of the industrial heartlands of the UK and the politics that went with it. It is also very much about the music that these tensions spawned as in those terms I would imagine word readers should check it out.
I saw it at the time and I saw it a number of times 10 years later and it still stood up in terms of acting, writing, plot and emotional punch.
OK so perhaps the special effects aging them weren't amazing. But what else are you going to do, have different actors play them? Impossible since every episode is 5 years or so after the last and when would you have the jarring changes. They had to do that with the little boy anyway, with the whole cast it would have been much less successful than the wigs and make up that they wen't with.
It was an amazing series and we have not seen its like since.
Yes we've had a few good things here and there. Cracker has its charms. As does most of what is mentioned above. But in terms of novelistic depth and epic televisual experience AFITN is the only thing to come close to the current golden age of US drama.
Life on Mars tried and nearly succeeded, I liked a lot about it, although it failed to be as beautifully conceived plotwise as its original premise and set up made it feel it would be.
Where we do hold our own is in comedy. British comedy is generally as good as the best that American can offer. From faulty towers, the office, peep show, the inbetweeners, even the mighty boosh or have I got news for you (in its glory days) are all classic and british.
Lest we forget
Loved OFITN, can we also have a special mention for Between the Lines, Singing Detective, Auf Wiedersehen, Pet; can I also do a shout for- yes I know it was rubbish- The Professionals.
What a cast.
What a story arc.
What performances.
Every single one of the main leads has gone on to do more great work.
I loved it. Gritty masterpiece, no doubt about it.
Just love it
I don't believe it: I just spent about 25 minutes writing a big spiel praising Our Friends In The North and then my window just crashed or something. Lost to the winds!
So instead I'll just say: I love Our Friends In The North. Probably my all time favourite TV show.
Someone up there mentioned GBH which is in the same league. And The Singing Detective, naturally.
@Mat Davies Heres an apt
@Mat Davies
Heres an apt treat: Daniel Craig in Between The Lines
Between The Lines
You've just reminded me of that - slipped my mind, but it was excellent.
Dont Look Back in Anger
Oasis finest moment?
Finest?
Only.
Better than The Wire
There, I've said it.
Admittedly, The Wire comes close - and managed to sustain the excellence for a full 5 series - but Our Friends in the North is still a clear winner.
I have never been so enthralled by a TV series before or since. Embrawumman and I could hardly wait until the next episode. I bought her the boxed set last year and we watched it again - it was still as good.
As others have mentioned, the interplay of the personal and political storylines is very effective and the use of music is masterful.
I'd never noticed the wigs/taches issues, however I will point out that when you look at photos from the past (especially of yourself) it does sometimes seem that wigs and false taches (if applicable) are being worn. I think that the period touches, from decor to costumes, are well done.
Golden Age of GB Drama
House of Cards
A Very British Coup
and GBH
Just remembered my favourite line:
When accused of having an affair Mark Strong's character says to his wife -
"There is naw woman, man!"
Wonderful.
"Mark Strong's character"
That would be the tremendously named Tosker Cox.
There should be more men named Tosker.
No mention so far of..
Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy.....Sir Alec G, Ian Richardson,Bernard Hepton, Hywell Bennett, Patrick Stewart, Beryll Reid, Joss Ackland, Michael Jayston, George Sewell, Terence Rigby, Ian Bannen, Nigel Stock, Michael Aldridge and Warren Clarke...
Story by John LeCarre..
A cast and plot to die for.
Never been bettered
Yes.
Absolutely brilliant. I watched this again quite recently & it completely stands up.
Place-holder...
EDIT The spammer was in da house
I just watched OFITN for the
I just watched OFITN for the first time this week and watched all 9 episodes in one day - absolutely outstanding loved every minute of it.