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Curious

Chimney Singing Cheryl Cole's picture

Why do people use the phrase 'de nos jours' when they could just say 'of our times'?

0

I don't know.

It just has a certain je ne sais quoi, I suppose.

12
Bob | 30 November 2010 - 2:13pm

Nobody

Nobody I know uses any kind of French phrase in everyday conversation. You're post is a Canard, a French term for an imaginary concern.

0
bathmat | 30 November 2010 - 5:53pm

Quack quack

1
Uncle Wheaty | 30 November 2010 - 8:39pm

Deja Vu

"Deja Vu" gets used a lot.

0
Mike_H | 1 December 2010 - 5:05pm

Deja Vu

"Deja Vu" gets used a lot.

1
Retro Man | 1 December 2010 - 7:50pm

Deja Vu

"Deja Vu"...sorry, I'll get my manteau...

2
Retro Man | 1 December 2010 - 7:53pm

Deja Vu

"Deja Vu" gets used a lot.

0
Hannah | 1 December 2010 - 7:55pm

This one could

run and run...!

0
Retro Man | 1 December 2010 - 7:57pm

:-)

You beat me to it, Retro! Great minds and all that...

0
Hannah | 1 December 2010 - 7:58pm

Because

they're prats?

1
Pat Carty | 30 November 2010 - 2:14pm

Pretentious

vaguely educated prats

1
el toro calvo grande | 30 November 2010 - 2:47pm

Pretentious

Moi?

1
paulwright | 30 November 2010 - 2:58pm

C'mon Paul,

I think you'll find that should be: pretentieux, me?

0
Mark JF | 30 November 2010 - 4:19pm

It's

the sine qua non of bon mots

3
Captain Underpants | 30 November 2010 - 2:16pm

no it's the non plus ultra

of bon mots

1
Chris G | 30 November 2010 - 2:18pm

No, it's the nonpareil...

...of mots justes.

1
Bob | 30 November 2010 - 2:19pm

Touché!

1
Captain Underpants | 30 November 2010 - 2:26pm

De nada.

1
Bob | 30 November 2010 - 2:29pm

Moi

non plus

2
Captain Underpants | 30 November 2010 - 2:32pm

Inceste de citron

1
Bob | 30 November 2010 - 2:37pm

Trois de plus d'eux plus tard

n'est-ce pas?

7
stimpy | 30 November 2010 - 3:36pm

la plume de ma tante

est dans le jardin.

2
badartdog | 30 November 2010 - 5:07pm

Ou est la bibliotheque

s'il vous plait?

1
Hannah | 30 November 2010 - 7:07pm

Uh ah uh je ne comprende pas

4
Chimney Singing... | 30 November 2010 - 7:13pm

Ahh!

Francais? Bonjovi mes amis

0
geacher53 | 30 November 2010 - 9:41pm

ici les enfants du paradis

?

1
Steerpike | 1 December 2010 - 7:56pm

I guess

it captures the zeitgeist, no?

1
Chimney Singing... | 30 November 2010 - 2:18pm

C'est La Vie...

1
Reno Dakota | 30 November 2010 - 2:27pm

Mange tout, Rodney,

mange tout...

6
Retro Man | 30 November 2010 - 2:27pm

Bonnet de douche, Rodney

Bonnet de douche...

2
Red Umpire | 30 November 2010 - 2:42pm

Pour encourager les autres

1
Gatz | 30 November 2010 - 2:28pm

l'enfer est les autres

2
Sheev | 30 November 2010 - 8:51pm

This reminds me of these:

(can't be bothered with the accents)

Crepe de chine = dog shit
Coup de grace = lawnmower
Canne a peche = tinned peaches

etc.

1
Captain Underpants | 30 November 2010 - 4:10pm

Bad memories

The first time I encountered the phrase Canne a peche was in the translation part of my French Mock O-Level.
The story involved a man going on a journey with his Canne a peche and struggling to do things like get on and off busses so my version when he was carrying around that can of peaches made absolutely no sense at all. I'm sure I wasn't the only one!

0
JohnW | 30 November 2010 - 6:21pm

In Scotland...

... "canne a peche" implies terrible urinary problems...

8
Glenbervie | 1 December 2010 - 12:42am

Sic Transit Gloria Mundi

if that's what you want

1
Five-Centres | 30 November 2010 - 3:26pm

I was sic in a Transit once...

Meanwhile, to show you how educated I am; here's some Latin.

Caesar adsum iam forte
Brutus aderat
Caesar sic in omnibus
Brutus sic inat

2
stimpy | 30 November 2010 - 3:38pm

If your surname was Mundi...

...or Mundy or something similar, would you be able to resist the urge to call your daughter Gloria? I'm not sure I would. I'm similarly not sure I'd be able to resist the urge to buy her this on her 17th birthday.

It would be a sick Transit.

2
Bob | 30 November 2010 - 3:39pm

THIS was a sick Transit

A Transit with a Formula 1 engine in the back.

2
stimpy | 30 November 2010 - 3:47pm

I've mentioned this before but ...

Shortly after Gloria Estafan's horrific coach crash nearly killed her The Sun printed a picture of her being conveyed from an ambulance to the hospital ina wheelchair. The story ran on a Tuesday, and the picture caption was 'Sick Transit Gloria, Monday'. Glorious!

0
Gatz | 30 November 2010 - 4:45pm

Because they have a certain level of

erudition, articulacy and intelligence and they aren't afraid, worried or bothered about showing it? Maybe they simply regard it as part of life's everyday speech?

3
Mark JF | 30 November 2010 - 4:18pm

It's useful

to have different ways to say the same thing. However esoteric or exotic expressions make the clunkiest cliches. "Drastic" cuts became "draconian". Then someone brought back the even more obsure "swingeing". Now all severe cuts are termed "swingeing", the archaic nature of the word draws attention to the cliche.
See also: "step up to the plate" - a cliche adapted from a sport which hardly anyone on these islands plays.

0
STD | 30 November 2010 - 5:42pm

I don't agree that words passively "become"

clunky or clichés. They get to feel that way because people misuse them. Calling a cut "swingeing" is often just lazy, emotional, biased reporting. In which case, we should criticise the journalist, not the words.

0
Mark JF | 30 November 2010 - 6:54pm

Exactly

mon ami, that's what I mean. Once "swingeing" is habitually bolted onto "cuts" by lazy reporters it becomes a cliche. I was just pointing out (re the OP) that this is more jarring to the ear when the word or term happens to be alien, foreign or esoteric.
When England next face a penalty shoot out, how ridiculous will it be to hear Alan Shearer (for example) ask which player will "step up to the plate" - a redundant metaphor when you have a spot to step up to - because he's locked into that expression by the thoughtless repetition of the phrase?

0
STD | 30 November 2010 - 7:22pm

Don't have too much of

a problem with some of the phrases. It can sound nicer on the ears to say that a pretty young thing (doing the Julie Christie walk in Billy Liar) has a certain "Je ne sais quoi" rather than "cor blimey, look at that" but some may disagree !

1
Francis Barry-Walsh | 30 November 2010 - 5:28pm

MacDonalds

I remember being in a MacDonalds once and someone in the queue in front of me asked for a fillet of fish but prononouced it as a "fill-ay of fish". You're in the wrong place guv I thought.

1
Retro Man | 30 November 2010 - 6:27pm

Fillay o' fish for my vife.

In fairness to the bloke you saw, Retro, Maccy D's pronounce it that way themselves. Christ alone knows what they're trying to prove.

0
Bob | 30 November 2010 - 7:56pm

Fillet vs. Fillay

I've bought food from McDonald's precisely twice in my adult life. Both times I had a fish burger. Both times I pronounced the ridiculous name of their disgusting product fillay. Was I wrong?

0
Red Umpire | 30 November 2010 - 8:32pm

A former McDonalds' employee writes

It's fillay, not fillet.

0
Fraser Lewry | 30 November 2010 - 8:39pm

yep

they said fillay last time I had one (about 1984 I think).

0
Captain Underpants | 30 November 2010 - 8:45pm

I stand corrected...

I had no idea that was the "official" version!

Jesus, I mean if they called it a "fill-ay de poisson" I could figure it...

0
Retro Man | 30 November 2010 - 11:59pm

"fee-lay" is the American pronunciation

A country where fishmongers' daughters never lie on slabs ...

0
Glenbervie | 1 December 2010 - 12:44am

Hey good on your cv

I worked at one of the first McD's in London too.

0
Lunaman | 1 December 2010 - 7:29pm

One Cup of Cha!

Sorry, kneejerk reaction.

0
milkybarnick | 30 November 2010 - 10:53pm

I'm so glad...

...someone picked up on that. I wonder if we're about the same age? I'm 32, and that advert was a playground joke for years after the event.

0
Bob | 30 November 2010 - 11:03pm

We are!

I'm 32 and yes, that advert was repeated loads at school. I forgot all about it for a few years until someone brought it up on TV Cream, I think.

Particularly like the bloke with the Big Mac fetish.

0
milkybarnick | 30 November 2010 - 11:20pm

I know!

Three Big Macs? That's his entire recommended calorie intake for the day, the greedy bastard!

0
Bob | 1 December 2010 - 12:12am

Perhaps

they are entrepreneurs?

0
Lando Cakes | 30 November 2010 - 6:36pm

I suppose it's de rigueur

if you're one of the avant garde.

Love, Monsieur Clef.

0
bassclef (not verified) | 30 November 2010 - 7:29pm

au contraire

Je t'aime... moi non plus

M. Duvet

0
Nick Duvet | 30 November 2010 - 9:19pm

Funnily enough

I was talking to my FPO about this yesterday. We both have French degrees, which may be a factor. Anyway, we were talking about someone who's a bit of a pain in the arse, and one of us used the phrase de trop, which you do here in English conversation now and then. Now obviously, you could say "oh gawd, he really is too much isn't he?" However, to me, the French phrase conveys the intended meaning just that little bit better, rolled eyes and all.

Not that there's anything wrong with the phrase "pain in the arse," by the way.

0
Rosbif | 30 November 2010 - 8:19pm

Boh...

.

0
Patrick Crowther | 30 November 2010 - 8:41pm

Voulez vous couchez avec moi,

c'est soir?

1
Gauntlet | 30 November 2010 - 8:45pm

you're right

it is evening. Now what was the question?

8
Captain Underpants | 30 November 2010 - 8:49pm

Really?

The Captain gets three ups, and no-one gives me one?

Though I'm sure you'd agree, unnecessary use of French as it is, lingerie is better than underwear...

*adjusts straps*

1
Gauntlet | 30 November 2010 - 11:24pm

I think it's because you

I think it's because you typed "c'est soir" rather than "ce soir", gauntlet. At the risk of being incredibly patronising, "c'est soir" means "it is evening", hence the Captain's ups. (Please, please, please forgive me if you knew that and I'm just being incredibly dense here...)

2
Red Umpire | 1 December 2010 - 12:02am

That's what I get for dashing off a quick one...

You, sir, are a perfect gentleman for taking the time to explain. Unlike those other cads and bounders... Now, how can I thank you properly?

1
Gauntlet | 1 December 2010 - 12:07am

How can you thank me properly?

Comme tu veux.

0
Red Umpire | 1 December 2010 - 12:19am

It certainly is

And camisole is sexier than vest...
*edit* this is a reply to the underwear/ lingerie post

1
STD | 1 December 2010 - 12:21am

Most things sound sexier in French

"Sous-vetements" sound infinitely more enticing than "Grundies"

0
Hannah | 1 December 2010 - 12:35am

Boudoir...

Soixante-neuf...

I see your point.

1
Gauntlet | 1 December 2010 - 12:51am

Captain...

I've been trying to work up some kind of witty line about me not being a French Lieutenant's Woman, but I can't. I think you've broken me...

1
Gauntlet | 1 December 2010 - 11:36am

Madamoiselle,

I do apologise, how terribly gauche of me. Picking you up on a minor point of grammar after an offer like that was a faux pas of the premier cru.

It's the equivalent of you saying "Fancy a shag, big boy?" and me replying "Oh, so you're saying I'm fat, are you?"

2
Captain Underpants | 1 December 2010 - 6:20pm

L'esprit d'escalier

I'll think of something clever and witty to say once I've switched the laptop off.

2
Lando Cakes | 30 November 2010 - 10:09pm

I only heard this phrase the other day

and was most pleased as we don't have phrase that I can think of for this particular occurrence. On the whole it's a bit late to start having a beef about "French" words in the English lanquage.

0
Chris G | 1 December 2010 - 11:09am

It's not French words in the English language

It's more that 'de nos jours' serves no purpose other than to make the speaker look pretentious. It's a simple translation of three simple words, a phrase our concept which is hardly untranslatable in the same way as something like schadenfreude (spelling). It doesn't simplify a difficult concept or supply greater erudition.

0
Chimney Singing... | 1 December 2010 - 11:30am

Faux pas with French

For some odd reason, when we borrow French we either balls up the grammar or get the meaning wrong. A "fracas", for example, isn't a "barney" or "rumble"; it's a "row", "din" or "racket" (à grand fracas means "at full belt/whack", i.e. "turned up to 11").

Frenchified English also often ends up in a kind of endless self-referential loop. More than one dictionary defines "blasé" as "nonchalant", which isn't a fat lot of use if your French isn't up to snuff.

But the odd thing is that it's not just us; the Spanish tend to get French wrong too. A fracaso isn't about loudness or even scrappy aggression - it means "flop" or "failure". (But then you think of our pat phrase "resounding failure", which brings us right back to the loud noises again.)

0
Archie Valparaiso | 1 December 2010 - 12:06pm

Faux Pas explained

In the north of England lived a man, poorly educated, who made a large fortune by selling his design for a bicycle chain. With this money he set about realising his childhood ambition to become a country squire. He purchased a beautiful estate near the Scottish border, and proceeded, with the help of some excellent servants, to live in a manner none in his family had ever dreamed of.

Foremost of these servants was his butler, Jeeves, a well educated man who assisted his master in every way he could to better himself. The master would often ask Jeeves for advice on how to handle a social situation, or to explain a new term.

One day when the master was reading he called Jeeves in and asked, "Jeeves, what is this fox pass?"

"Sir," replied Jeeves, "that would be 'faux pas.' I'll give you an example.

Do you remember recently when Lord and Lady Plushbottom stayed for the weekend? And do you remember how on Sunday morning Lord Plushbottom pricked his finger on a rose? "And do you further remember how later, at breakfast, Lady Plushbottom asked her husband 'Is your prick still throbbing dear?' and you said 'Christ!' and I dropped the marmalade?

"That, Sir, was a faux pas"!!

3
Gavin Adam | 1 December 2010 - 6:40pm

fair enough it's not the title of play

or the motto for something or a bit of poetry that's often the route into usage. I think the more interesting ones are "cul de sac" which don't appear in french much like R.S.V.P I believe.

0
Chris G | 1 December 2010 - 12:10pm

A native French speaker

once told me "cul de sac" isn't used in France because "cul" is a rather vulgar term like "arse" only ruder...

0
STD | 1 December 2010 - 1:12pm

Arse of a bag

Why do we call a dead end street an "arse of a bag" in a phrase that the French don't use? I've never understood that.

And what's wrong with the perfectly serviceable "dead end street" anyway...?

0
Red Umpire | 1 December 2010 - 1:16pm

Don't cul-de-sacs...

(which should be called culs de sac, really, but I digress)... tend go sort of big and bulbous at the end (oh, Gauntlet) so that cars can turn round, while dead-end streets just end with the wall of a warehouse or something?

1
Archie Valparaiso | 1 December 2010 - 2:32pm

Je ne sais pas

0
Red Umpire | 1 December 2010 - 2:38pm

She also told me

the way I pronounced "beaucoup" made it sound like I was saying "nice arse". She did have a nice arse, so I got pleasure from continuing to pronounce it that way.

0
STD | 1 December 2010 - 4:21pm

I think also the actual place a "cul-de-sac"

is a particularly English town plannning invention and so in the 20's (?) when they first came about we coined an aspirational name for them that sound better in "metroland" estate agents' blurb than "dead end"!

0
Chris G | 1 December 2010 - 1:17pm

Well

romanes eunt domus OR romani ite domum.
Get it wrong and I'll cut your balls off....

0
geacher53 | 30 November 2010 - 10:17pm

Tit Zut!

Pour le hommes

0
Beezer | 30 November 2010 - 11:02pm

No comment

I'm incomunicado.

0
Archie Valparaiso | 30 November 2010 - 11:35pm

Ne pas me tenir à*

"Well how did all this happen?"
"Just all at once really. The Italians have a word for it."
"What word what is it?"
"A thunderbolt or something."
"What, you mean the Italian word for thunderbolt?"
"Yeah, something like that. I don't speak Italian myself you understand."
"No."
"But I knew a man who did."

*According to Google Translator

0
Con Coleman | 1 December 2010 - 9:07am

Deja Vu

"Deja Vu" gets used a lot.

3
Captain Underpants | 1 December 2010 - 6:22pm

You've posted that tw...

...oh I see. Clever!

0
Red Umpire | 1 December 2010 - 7:24pm

Ooh I love a bit of French, me.

I did A level and the oral examination involved me complaining that I had been bitten by a dog to a sour-faced middle aged bat who turned out to be my French tutor at University two years later. It reminded me of this clip:

0
Richie B | 1 December 2010 - 7:50pm

Who gives a shit?

(excuse my French).

1
Nick | 2 December 2010 - 2:19am
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