Entertainment For Lively Minds
Best Plairces t'live int North
Posted by BigE on 11 February 2012 - 12:58pm.
I am returning home to the UK in a week, after 6 years in Australia. I've got a job, publishing rep, and my territory is the north of England. I just don't know where to start looking for somewhere to live.
I'm hoping to live in a small town, but I don't really know where. I don't fancy Leeds or Manchester. I like the idea of somewhere small, like Otley or Holmfirth, but never having lived in a small northern town I don't know where would be great and where might be 'orrible.
If anyone can give me any advice - places good, places to avoid, I would be very appreciative.
Thanks
(PS title of thread changed to reflect my new local status)
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Fancy that...
...I'm a publishing rep and my territory is the North of England.
I live in Lancaster: ideal for the job because it's just off the M6, (45mins from either Liverpool or Manchester, 90 mins from Leeds or Bradford) but handier still for the bucolic splendour of the Lakes or the Dales. Lancaster itself isn't really a city - but its got lots of cityesque attractions, (a couple of decent theatres, an art house cinema, several decent pubs and restaurants) and retains that small town charm. If you want somewhere a bit more Pennine and central, then the Colne Valley has a lot going for it too, (Hebden Bridge, Huddersfield and Halifax have a lot more to offer than you might think - read Simon Armitage's 'Gig' if you want a better feel for that part of the world).
Feel free to drop me a line if you want any advice on the state of the book industry up here. Happy hunting...
Fancy that indeed!
Lancaster, eh? I would never thought of that. Brilliant. I shall definitely check it out, thanks! You had me at "a couple of decent theatres, an art house cinema".
I definitely had Halifax in mind, too (and used to enjoy day trips to Hebden Bridge when I was growing up in Leeds, but that article in The Word about the heroin problems there kind of put me off). For some reason I used to think Halifax was posh, but I think that's cos we had a posh kid at school who was from there.
I appreciate the generosity of your response :-)
Hebden Bridge
My best mate still lives there. She absolutely loves it. (She's not a heroin addict). Everywhere's got its problems...
I've lived all over the north. For my money, you can't beat Sheffield. Big enough to be interesting, small enough to be friendly, bang on the doorstep of the gorgeous Peak District. I'd love back there tomorrow if I wasn't so tied to London now...
Strangely enough
my best mate lives there also, and from my numerous visits there can attest that it's a lovely little place (not so good if you don't like hills, mind).
Of course, you can barely move for all the corpses littering the streets...and those flying pigs are a bit of a nuisance, too! ;-)
Hahaha!
Yep, I do love visiting Hebden Bridge. It's gorgeous. My best mate's always on at me to move there. One day I think I will, but not til the kids have grown up.
It is that kind of place
I always used to think that, too. The thought of going into semi-retirement in Hebden Bridge and opening a junk shop always appealed to me. And the walk up to Heptonstall cemetry is one of my favourites.
Correct answer is obviously
Correct answer is obviously Sheffield, bang on the M1 and really just a collection of villages. Only thing which lets it down is the terrible state of the roads.
Sheffield area
Sheffield's pretty damn good. Technically I live just over the border in north east Derbyshire, but Sheffield's where I work. Stayed on after my degree like so many others and it ticks plenty of boxes, especially with the Peak District on the doorstep. The roads are bad, though.
I too...
... did the stay-on-after-degree thing in SHeffield. It seems to be de riguer.
Not sure I'd recommend Sheffield for our lad's purposes. The nicest bits are in the west where the city buts up against the Peak District National Park but the M1 is to the east of the city so you can spend a long time crossing the city before you get any where north or south.
Sheffield
I have 2 friends in Sheffield. One was a single father of 3 teens, originally from East Anglia (all kids now grown up and only the youngest still at home). The other is a mature student, recently separated from her partner of 4-5 years. Also from the South originally.
Both absolutely love it there and wouldn't dream of moving.
Heroin, eh?
Quelle horreur. I live in Newcastle which has a fairly serious heroin problem, as well as issues with crack and skunk. The only evidence I see of heroin users is when I go into Boots and see the poor (in every sense of the word) whey-faced teenagers who go in for their daily Methadone. It's life and not just urban life either and I'm neither repelled nor outraged by coming into contact with Class A drug users. If I wanted to avoid the harsher aspects of life - including pub fights - I suspect I'd spend a lot of time at home
Come On Baby Let's Go Downtown
Hi Toffee The Cat
You've assumed distaste and outrage are at the root of my desire to stay the hell away from Class A hotspots. Not so, my good man, not so.
Duplicate
"
Small world....
I've just returned to Bookshop Management a couple of years out. Maybe not the smartest career move but hey, I missed it. I'm based in Manchester so Prestonia, BigE- hopefully our paths will cross at some point.
Annoying...
... How do I delete a duplicate post?
I don't know
...and if I respond, will my reply also be duplicated?
Are you managing a high street bookshop or an academic bookshop? (If it's a Waterstones, kudos to your company for no longer participating in the Tory slave labour scheme, by the way.)
Tantamount..
..I've been doing this forever, so chances are we've run into one another at some point. I'm Bloomsbury's man in t'North?
E - also worth pointing out, most of the work on this patch is rooted in the West, (the wholesalers, library suppliers, key academic calls and the greater concentration of indies). Basing yourself any further East than Leeds would be making life difficult for yourself, (also, Sheffield: there's not much going on bookshop wise and everywhere else is a bugger to get to from The Steel City, great place to live though it is).
Fantastic!
That is great advice, obviously from experience. You probably saved me a couple of years in travelling time there; very much appreciated.
Are you on your 5th cup of tea yet?
Duplicate posts
Can't be deleted, unfortunately. The etiquette on here tends to be that if you double post, you then edit one of the posts to remove your original comment (e.g. change the subject to something like ".", or "double post" and the comment to something similar, so people can easily see the post is to be skimmed over).
Wherabouts in Lancaster ?
I've got very happy memories of Lancaster, my folks had a caravan at Cockerham Sands for 15 years, I learned to drink up there, my favourite pub was The Stork at Conder Green.
Great days, my friend actually still lives up that way.
Not far...
..from The Stork, which is till going strong. As is the caravan park I think, (at least the sign's still there).
Aye, it still is.
My mate still lives up there
Haven't been for a couple of years, must make a trip up there this summer.
Formby's nice...
... don't live there anymore - but if you like lots of charity shops, interspersed with Cafe Neros and Costas it's the place to be.
Life in a Northern Town
Where's your patch? If you're mainly going to be working in the east, then look for somewhere on that side (and vice versa) - believe me, you really really don't want to be parked on the M62 between Leeds and Manchester every day.
If you fancy the Cheshire plains, Chester's a nice place, or Knutsford/Macclesfield/Alderley Edge, although they can be a bit 'Footballers' Wives' for some tastes.
On the east of the country, York is lovely, as is Harrogate.
cheers
M62 not good then? Bugger. I think I'll end up spending a fair bit of time on that stretch.
Thanks, I'll give York a good looking at. Harrogate I've always been a bit wary of. I know it's meant to be a bit genteel, but I once saw the ugliest and most violent pub fight ever there on an otherwise quiet Sunday afternoon. About 20 people took part, it was nasty. Full of squaddies, isn't it?
Harrogate
is a bit of a law unto itself. Big army training camp to the west does mean that there are lots of squaddies about, but the town - which is build in the middle of a fairly desolate moor - has a seriously upmarket self image, and is often seen as a mass of Range Rovers and Ladies who lunch, despite a large area of relative poverty in the east and a huge commuter area to the south around Pannel.
hmmmmm
Full of Hyacinth Bucket's then? Not my bag! Thanks for confirming :-)
But it does have Betty's
Mmmm, Curd Tarts and Fat Rascals.
"books train ticket to Harrogate"
Hyacinth Buckets!!!
What a nerve! I live there and am no such thing. Gosh I hope the neighbours don't see this thread - what would they think?!
Seriously, though. I moved up here from down south about five years ago and quite like it here. Harrogate has quite a lot going on for the size of the place. The conference centre means there's an enormous number of Restaurants and that sort of thing. Going out in town of a weekend, we find it's big enough that there are plenty of pubs and people but not so big that it ever gets scary. (Swindon, where I come from, has definite no-go areas.)
It's on the edge of the Dales so the local scenery is just amazing - I'm out cycling it at weekends. And it's half-hour on a train to Leeds or York.
It isn't the best place in the whole world, but it's pertty good.
I'd also recommend Knaresborough, which is next door. Otley looks alright, but it's a bit scruffy - I'd prefer Ilkley or Skipton.
Macclesfield
Having grown up there and gone to college in Manchester I fondly remember the view in my Dad's rear view mirror as I headed for Oxford Poly. I melodramatically vowed I'd never go back there, and, inconvenience of college hols (when I couldn't go somewhere else) aside, I never did. Lovely countryside though.
Bingley for me
Lovely around there, Bronte country.
These boys had something to say about it all
Inevitably..
But I think they were just trying to discourage too many Lahn-dahn-ers from getting here.
It's Macclesfield, isn't it? It gets a mention here, it's got a footy team, it's less than 2 miles to some really good hills (if not quite the Illawarra escarpment), 5 proper micro-breweries - and the pubs in which to buy the beer, it's handy for Manchester (tho' not unless you have to taxi home after a hard night parting at Twisted Nerve).
When you get off the 'plane, ask the nice taxi people for a ticket to Macclesfield, Cheshire SK10.
You are joking, right?
It used to be a nice little town, since they carved a massive elevated road right through the centre it has been destroyed. I still visit friends there who despair at the state of the place. Key roads end at blank walls, shops closed, etc. It should be advertised as a living museum of how bad town planning can destroy a place.
Anything else you can suggest to narrow it down?
Lots of suggestions come to mind, but it depends what else you want - t'North has it all... Do you want easy access to hills and countryside, or London and big metropolises at the weekend? These might influence your decision.
Geography wise, it's worth remembering that, broadly, from west to east you go from the flat plains of Lancashire/Cheshire, up onto the Pennines via the A66 or M62. Then you cross river and dale til you get to Leeds/Sheffield when the land drops down to the flat Vale of York and the sea. All that combined with prevailing westerly winds means that west is wet, more wet the closer you get to the Pennines. East is windy but much drier.
In the west, have a look at Ramsbottom (good road links, small town, steam railway), Knutsford (genteel, pretty, footballers) and Prestonia's suggestion of Lancaster.
In the east, Wetherby is worth looking at - close to the A1, good local cinema, close enough for nights out and culture in Leeds and York. Knaresborough is also an unsung gem of a place. Otley is lovely but a long way from the motorway network.
Anywhere twenty miles east of the M1 is generally quieter, cheaper and flatter than places 20 miles west, likewise west of the M6 is quieter than the eastern side
In the middle, Marsden, Hebden Bridge and Todmorden are great places to be - although Todmorden and HB are quite away from motorways, as is your suggestion of Holmfirth (which is also, as you've guessed, a lovely place to live).
And, yes, I'd agree that the M62 is a necessary evil - a car park at rush hour and in bad weather. And the weather is often bad...
Thanks Fridge
Cheers for this. I guess I will be needing to be close-ish to the motorway system, though I'll only really be travelling during academic semesters, the rest of the time I will be working from home.
Holmfirth appeals because they have a good cinema, a film festival and a folk festival, which tells me there is a healthy cultural scene there (for a small town). Anywhere where there is life after 6 o'clock - a theatre, maybe, or an art house cinema, maybe a gig venue on the "circuit", some good pubs, and some hills for vigorous walks, some strapping northern lasses, and not too expensive to rent or buy a place...I know it's asking a lot! I don't care too much about the weather - after Australia, cold and rain sound quite appealing (though not for too long, I'm sure).
I shall definitely check out "the middle" towns, so thanks for the tips. Growing up in Leeds I still think of Knaresborough as being full of pensioners and Wetherby full of footballers!
Thanks.
Holmfirth
I live in Huddersfield but one of the major attractions of the area is the Holmfirth Picturedrome which has regular great gigs and is a lovely venue. We've seen Ron Sexsmith, Nick Lowe, Toots and the Maytals ....
http://www.picturedrome.net/
Knutsford Calling
Well, my instincts make me want to shout up for my home town. I do like the fact that I live in the country, yet can consider arts events in Liverpool, Manchester, even Leeds, just about. It's very accessible and I find it friendly. But, to be honest, I probably wouldn't choose to live here if not for my roots. Housing is bloody expensive and, while it's a very cultured town, with plenty of clubs and societies, it is certainly conservative in tastes. In fact, it would be livened up if we really did have all the footballers' wives alleged to stalk our streets - if they're here, I certainly don't notice them.
No-one's mentioned Buxton yet. The Opera House gets loads of events and it's slap bang in the middle of the Peak District. It's a bit of a distance from a motorway, mind, and the main drawback is the climate; it is 1000ft up and you feel it. But it's worth considering.
Knutsford. It's the future.
I've lived in Knutsford for the past 18 months, I really like it. I am a South Mancunian but latterly lived in St Ives Cornwall so I know the attractions of both city and countryside.
Knutsford is an affluent town but unlike, say, Alderley Edge it is not up its own arse. It genuinely is very friendly. Thankfully the footballers tend not to live here (although every other car seems to be a Range Rover) so we don't see too many wannabe WAGS wandering around.
House prices are higher than nearby towns but I have a very modest terraced and in no way can I be described as wealthy or well-off.
Its a brilliant base for travelling up and down the country although it seems virtually every night the town gets a name-check on BBC radio courtesy of the Traffic and Travel bulletins warning of delays at junction 19 of the M6.
Marsden
I am considering a move to Marsden, so I am interested that you recommend it. How well do you know it? I have visited a few times now, and even have my eye on a house there, so I'd appreciate your thoughts.
A good friend lives in Marsden, so I visit fairly often
It's got a great Jazz Festival, is close to Holmfirth for the Picturehouse and Leeds, Bradford and Manchester are all accessible for an evening out, and has good local traditions in Moonraking and the (admittedly recent) IMBOLC festival.
It's also on a railway line, which can help, and has at least two great locals (we rarely venture elsewhere) in the Riverhead Brewery Tap and the Tunnel Head Inn.
Great walking from most doorsteps make it a pretty good 'big village/small town' in my book.
Thanks for the confirmation
Thanks for this.
Maybe we could have a little get-together in one of the locals if I settle there.
All welcome, of course ...
I also
have a friend who moved to Marsden from that London and is very happy
Marsden mingle ...
... is becoming less of a pipe dream and more of a pipe and slippers dream (given Marsden's laid-back character, one of its many attractions).
Barnestoneworth
Used to have a good football team - 'Haggerty R, Haggerty F ..
Palin and Cleese live there.
Denley Moor is nice too
- trouble is, it's always raining.
Except when it's fine
And even then, there's a lot of moisture in the air.
*sniggers*
I see what you're doing here! You guys...
The north you say.....
Well....Muswell Hill, Barnet and Mill Hill are nice. I think after that "Thar be monsters".
Be wary of Lancashire
My sat nav brought this up.
had to edit as my picture had disappeared
You're coming back?
From Australia?
Now?
Are you mad?
Aw, don't say that!
I know Australia is very appealing from a distance. I also know that knocking the UK is one of the national pastimes. But it is home. I'm from the North. I've tried settling in Australia and I just can't do it here, so while the exchange rate is sensationally great and my homesicknesses shows no sign of abating, it has to be done. If I may indulge in cliche, home is where the heart is.
Just out of curiosity
where in Oz did you try settling?
Oz
Sydney initially. Possibly the most self-regarding place in the world. Nothing is cornier than a Sydney hipster. Impossible to walk through a market without encountering guys in their 50s wearing pork-pie hats, crazy shirts, and playing ukelele's. Groovy. The "hipper than thou" aspect I found to be cringeworthy and nauseating. King Street in Newtown is one of the worst places in the world. Up themselves? Just a tad. Home of self-conscious bohemianism of the worst kind. "Yes, we are all individuals."
Ridiculously expensive, too. The Inner West is "the place to be". Once people get installed there it's as though all their dreams have come true, and they become way too cool for school; scene-chasers without a scene. Every 3rd person is a self-proclaimed artist - or "ardist". The slop they produce is beyond description. It's the scene that celebrates itself. The only book I ever saw people reading on public transport was Antony Keidis's Scar Tissue. I did meet a few great people there, though they were generally feeling displaced in Sydney themselves, dreaming of Melbourne or London or Berlin. Lots of sourness. Psycho-geographically, I describe Sydney as being like Birmingham, if the locals considered themselves the coolest people in the world, and if it had a really nice harbour. If you like beaches, mass culture, women with tattoos, and the Red Hot Chili Peppers, I'd recommend Sydney.
Then Melbourne. A great city. If I wasn't moving home, I'd go back there. They have seasons in Melbourne. It's a very cultured. One of my favourite cities in the world. I had to leave because of work, sadly. The locals are very friendly; it felt somewhat European, so that was nice for me. Lived in St Kilda and loved it. Yeah, Melbourne's got something.
Now Brisbane. Walk through the city and it feels like a police state. I cannot get along with the climate, it's brutal. My neighbours cheerfully admit to being right-wing. Well, it has a history second only to South Africa, really. Whatever it is that feeds my soul, it ain't here.
I expect I shall get slated by any Australians on this site; so be it. There are great people everywhere in the world, but all cities have their dominant flavour. Overall I see Australia as a culture that places great store in conformity, and the bohemian quasi-semi-demi-monde are just as conformist in their own way as everyone else. To me it stifles originality, and I find so much Australian culture to be derivative and a bit obvious (Chris Lilley a notable exception). Most of the best Australians live in the UK anyway! Funny, that, eh? And I can't stand the heat, so I'm getting the hell out of this kitchen.
An ageist hipster writes ...
I live in Newtown. It's not THAT bad. Oh, wait, yes it is actually. Never mind the hipsters though, it's got some nice places to eat and Goulds book emporium.
Meanwhile my nomination for the handiest place to live in the north would be Drighlington, between Leeds and Bradford. Nice villagey feel (are you local?), handy for the M62 and very affordable compared to the overpriced places in the Dales where the all the houses have been bought up by the likes of Janet Street Porter.
Has a nice chippy but the best pub in the village has shut. That's why I'm not going back to Leeds/Yorkshire. It doesn't feel like home any more.
Goulds
Is that place still going? He died a while ago didn't he, the guy who ran it. I would have thought it'd shut down after his passing. I could never get over how expensive it was, but for late night browsing it was pretty good.
I know what you mean about the effect of favourite pubs closing...I have a few old favourites around Horsforth & Headingley that I'm looking forward to revisiting and hope and pray they haven't been Wetherspoon'd.
Business as usual
Goulds is still going, though the book stacks are looking slightly more organised than in the past - which is a worry. I think his wife is running the place.
I used to be a 'rep' with a patch that covered most of Yorkshire. I found that living in the Morley area with access to the M62/M621/M1 made it relatively easy to get just about anywhere. And if you've lived in Australia, everything in the UK seems so close together.
However, when I lived in Headingley I found I was spending an hour or more extra every day negotiating my way in and out of the city.
I envy your move back to the UK - I would do the same if it were not for the fact that there's no work there for meand my kids are settled in school here.
comparative distances
Yeah, you're telling me! A five hour drive is nothing, after working here...just load up on tunes and away I go. What I'm looking forward to in the UK is the variety of scenery. Here in Oz you can travel north from Melbourne and the landscape doesn't really change for 2500km, till you get past Rockhampton. It reminds me of the background of the Flintstones, the same trees, rocks, empty space, trees, rocks, empty space...
I grew up in Australia between the ages of 5 to 12. You are doing a great thing for your children - I would not have wanted to be a child anywhere else than Australia, which is a brilliant place to grow up, it has to be said.
As an Aussie I should give you a fearful ticking off
but I'm not going to I just popped into the thread to say I had a good chuckle at the comparison to the Flintstones.
When I was 18 or so I took a bus from Melbourne to Sydney. We passed the same silo about fifteen times. I was looking around the bus at the other passengers who all appeared quite calm. I was thinking, "We are travelling in circles but no one has noticed but me." You feel as though you're in a strange vortex, "An hour ago this place was called something else. What are they up to?"
Before you go home you should, unless you've done it already, cross the Nullabor. Just get in a train or a bus or a car (not a plane or a boat)and go to Perth. You'll be bored shitless and you won't thank me for it but you will have an experience you won't ever forget. It's truly awesome, as are the tricks it plays on your mind, you think it can't possibly be real but it is.
No regrets then
Yeah, where's my ticking off? Very funny about your journey! It is very true...
I'm glad to say that I have crossed the Nullabor. I tried hitching from Perth to Adelaide to visit my brother when I was young & stupid. Got as far as Kalgoorlie, then got stranded and gave it up as a bad job and caught the bus the rest of the way. I don't think the truckies fancied me as a travelling companion, and I can't say I blame them. It is amazing, saw a massive full pink moon too. So I guess I've done all I shoulda done and can leave.
"...go to Perth. You'll be bored shitless..." can be taken a number of ways you know! I like Perth, you see brunettes there, and living on the east coast I'd almost forgotten they existed.
The ticking off would have just
been along the lines of places are what you make of them. Two people could be standing side by side staring at the same landscape and see different things, one could see nothing but emptiness and the other a boundless horizon. People see things how they choose to see them. It's funny Australia looms much larger in the English psyche than vice-versa. I think it's because to an Englishman Australia represents an alternate life, "My grandad was thinking of emigrating" but the reverse is seldom true.
Whenever I hear of people going back home I always remember this Scot I used to work with. For six months he bored everyone and anyone about his upcoming trip home and how he was sick of Australia and would be glad to see the back of it. He was planning on retiring there. When he returned I asked him how it went and he muttered "I'm never going back" and never mentioned Scotland again. I don't know how long he'd been in Australia but it was a lot longer than six years and your perceptions and expectations of the UK will be a lot sharper and realistic than his were.
By the way I've got nothing against Perth, I'm just in no hurry to ever cross the Nullabor again!
Home Again
Back 2 days, staying with friends in Haworth, and being home is better than I even dreamed it could be. My god, everyone's a comedian, here. I'd forgotten how important just having a laugh was. Friendly, chatty, funny, and people are interested in things here...I'd really forgotten what that was like. Even after having gotten horribly lost in Bradford for over an hour, this has been the best 36 hours I've had in years and years and years...
"Excuse me, I'm lost...do you know the Bradford turn-off?"
"I should do, I married her"
(apologies to either Alan Bennett or Les Dawson...)
Cliches are sometimes true
Australians I know in the UK - and in my weird bit of IT there are lots - will bore for hours (they aren't all boring people) about the perfection of the Australian climate and how in effect that means all bets are off, its the best place in the world. I like the fact that so much British humour and curiosity comes from the fact that with the exception of a sub-section of dimwits and racists most Engish people enjoy the fact that this plainly ISN'T the best place to live imaginable.
In fact it makes teasing humourless Australians even more enjoyable...
too right
Totally agree. I love the fact that in the UK "we" constantly knock it, humorously, whereas Australians all humourlessly go on about what a great country they live in. I know which I prefer! Never known a people so sure of their own country's perfection; an arrogance that ironically makes it a rather tedious place to live.
The weather...jeeeezus! Of all the lame reasons to think you live in a great country, that is the lamest.
Never forget...
Horsforth and Headingley
That was my home from 1987-91. Straight after leaving University I lived in Headingley and then bought a house in Horsforth - happy days.
I have just checked on my old regular restaurant on Town Street in Horsforth - The Outside Inn - to see that it has just closed down after 30 years, It would appear not changing their menu for 30 years had been a marketing tactic!
Oh dear.
Mrs BP lived in Headingley before I knew her
and has fond memories of the area. She remembers the Outside Inn as well as the Lounge Cinema and the Hyde Park cinema too. She was amused that I didn't know that a back to back house was really that. I thought it was just a back street terrace like on Coronation Street.
Headingley
The Original Oak and the Skyrack, if memory serves. Two great pubs twenty years ago. are they still?
Both are still going strong...
...although Headingley is now Bar Central, with loads of new places which have opened in the last two decades (See wikipedia's Otley Run page for details of some of them).
OK providing
you don't mind students. Headingley is the main home for students shared houses, and the facilities have over recent years become more and more skewed towards that market. A lot of the roads full of student houses are appallingly dirty and litter-strewn.
Mind, I only visit Headingley because that's where Yorkshire CCC play their cricket.
I spent a year living in Paddington
I absolutely loved it. Like a flat San Francisco. Admittedly it was about 20 years ago.
Australia has never held any attraction for me
and I can fully understand your reasons for returning. It's just that their economy appears to be a little bit more robust than ours at this moment.
Hey, it was good enough for Leggy Mountbatten...
Anyway, I'm from Adelaide, so in no position to argue (or so those from the eastern states would believe, they think there's nothing west of the state borders)
Having lived in Sydney for over 20 years, I can
definitely state that Adelaide is a wonderful place, beautiful city, beautiful cricket ground, beautiful parks surrounding the city mile, beautiful beaches, beautiful wine country....it's a bugger being limited by work.
Can't imagine living back in a place that freezes regularly though.
Oh, and King Street is up itself. Like totally. As an inner westie I spend more time in Balmain (pubs), Leichhardt (food) and home (old fart).
North Riding
Thirsk and Ripon both nice and Masham nicer, if not really a town. Not a huge amount going on but striking distance of other places with more 'facilities'. If you like a bit of groomed shabbiness, Tadcaster is a lot more charming than it sounds.
If you can afford it, though, go for York. Very pretty, lots of lovely houses, fair bit of cultural activity and fab shopping. But heaving with tourists.
Masham
with the two best pubs in the world: The Black Sheep Brewery and The White Bear. Back in the ancient past (late 90's) I did the Black Sheep's website when I was at a previous employ. Paul Theakston's a top bloke, and now the Theakston family have control of the brewery again, it's nice to sample the best pint of Old PEculier in the country in the White Bear. spent some very nice times in both places.
It's not cheap, of course, but nowhere nice is nowadays.
York every time.
York every time.
Somewhat rough on a night
Somewhat rough on a night though.
Have you tried
Watford?
That's north to them there Londoners
May I add that
the North starts at Inverness and extends to Shetland which is quite near Bergen
In 1982 I lived for six months in Moss Side, Manchester
It was rough.
Breaking news
It still is. Very.
Interested in gigs? Or eating? Or football?
Then you need to be near Manchester. I did a quick count of events on Seetickets:
Manchester 600
Leeds 180
Liverpool 210
Sheffield 210
Then I counted restaurants on Tripadvisor:
Manchester 721
Leeds 480
Liverpool 402
Sheffield 397
Finally, I counted football teams:
Manchester 2
Leeds 0
Liverpool 0
Sheffield 0
(ducks)
That was actually very
Funny - and I don't even follow your football
Funny but incorrect
Surely football teams should be;
Manchester 1
Trafford 1
Paulwright is obviously a Blue
That's v. naughty. Be nice.
Ha ha etc...
Nice one Wrighty
I have friends who should be sponsored by Qantas, they've gone back and forth so often.
Speaking of Trafford, can I give a belated word for Altrincham. Near the M56, M6 and M60, trams into Manchester, 10 minute drive or half hour walk and you're in the middle of the countryside. More friendly than Wilmslow.
New thread
expanding on this subject is this way
http://www.wordmagazine.co.uk/content/manchester-v-liverpool-not-about-f...
And the answer is...
Morecambe. Obviously.
I've never been
but I'd love to see this
http://www.midlandhotel.org/
The recently restored art deco Midland hotel with sculpture by Eric Gill who also did the frontage on St James Park tube station
I went to a wedding
I went to a wedding reception of a Word reader ("Hiya!" if you're reading) there in November. The building is lovely but Morecambe still seemed a bit rough around the edges as I remembered it from my first trip to a football match there in November 2007 and the Radio 1 Road Show at Happy Mount Park in 1990.
Incidentally, thanks to the happy couple's tastes in tunes, it was comfortably the best wedding reception I've ever been to.
Morecambe is (sadly)
More like Hastings than Brighton - a bit of a dumping ground for problem benefit families. Mind it is a few years since I was going there so happy to be contradicted
Brighton...
..they say it's the Morecambe of the South. The Midland is well worth a trip.
Coast to Coast
An architect suggested that realistically the M62 is the high street of one big city stretching from Hull (where I come from) to Liverpool (who I support - don't judge - I come from East Hull and therefore do not support Hull City). I've lived in Leeds, Altrincham (Hale) and Bradford (Shipley). My GLW works in Widnes.
M62 is not so bad, though it is a problem for the next year because of road works. Holmfirth looks absolutely brilliant. Beautiful and with the Picturehouse (and a vinyard). I like cities - and on that I would rather go for Manchester than Leeds (and certainly not Bradford). Otley and Ilkley are nice but startlingly right wing. Harrogate is, as another poster mentioned, surprisingly mixed. And I would reiterate - do not move east of the A1 unless you are willing to accept isolation. York is lovely but remote. Hull is just remote.
Welcome back - despite the frequent comments, it is a great country.
Hull
Thanks for the advice!
I'd really like to move to Hull, but I don't think it'd be feasible, sadly. I've been looking online at properties to rent in Yorkshire and saw some flats available in Preston Park, Mr Larkin's old 'hood, and got rather excited about the idea...but as you say, just too remote.
You mean Pearson Park.
I live in Hull and it's, quite frankly, a toilet.
i always think of Hull
as a small island off the coast of Yorkshire. I worked there for six months, liked it enough, then left and would not rush to live there. The 'Avenues' area around Pearson Park is nice enough, but it's a mess of a city.
Geography
people are often surprised that Hull is not on the coast (it is about 20 miles inland), and how far away it is - about 30 miles from York and 60 miles from Leeds. It is an island city surrounded to the north by flat farmland, and to the south by a river.
Very cheap housing, a shrinking population, and mostly below sea level (so beware flooding).
Now renamed "The gateway to Hockney country"
Lived in Hull for a decade or so and it was a real mixed bag - cheap housing, the locals less than friendly to start with but I came to really love the place for its stubborn individuality and remoteness. Also had a record and book shop - ha...no one liked soul/jazz or reading - but it was fun while it lasted.
To the east you have Holderness and the magical Spurn Point and to the north Beverley and beyond the Wolds which are very much the central feature of David Hockney's new exhbition - went the other week and it really did make me think I ought to move back there. Felt a bit of a chippy northerner with all the southern folks "maaahvelling" at this and that when I doubt they hadn't a clue where he was actually picturing.
If you are going to Hull - might want to give the Endyke pub a wide birth. The locals don't like to be told to stub out their fags...
http://www.thisishullandeastriding.co.uk/escape-chainsaw-terror-Hull-s-E...
It's awful. There's a big max security prison in Hull
it's called Not Being Able To Afford To F***ing Move Out.
No parole. Ever.
I am in Hull Right Now
It is a very depressing and ugly place. The city centre is full of To Let signs. It really is a toilet. There is nowhere to get a good cup of coffee. It is the first place I've been in the last 12 days where I haven't even wanted to go in a pub. I wrote in my notebook "the good-looking people must have all fled the local gene pool years ago".
But get outside of Hull into east Riding and it's bee-yoo-ti-ful. You can see why Hockney wanted to move back, and I love the fact that the locals in Bridlington are so totally blase about the fact that the greatest living artist (any takers for an argument?) is now based there.
That said, something ought to be done about the miles of rubbish seemingly just poured onto the side of the road as you approach Hull. It creates the impression of a city populated by total savages, and is quite disgusting. We live in a beautiful country, and what do we do? Throw shit all over it.
The pubs are okay...
...no really, they are. And they have one of the widest age ranges I've ever experienced, from barely legal to OAPs. The OAPs mean that the beer is usually good too. Try the Olde Black Boy or the White Harte in town, or go out to Beverley which has a bunch of great pubs around the Kings Head...
I'm In Beverley at the moment
and it is loveley!
Some of the houses and terraces are very graceful and so well-kept. Typical English Minster town. Love The architecture.
Gill...
...an extraordinary man - typographer (Gill Sans among many others) sculptor, artist and, er, well you can read about him here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesign/2006/jul/22/art.art We've had debates on here before about whether an artist/musician's private life should influence ones feelings about their work and Gill certainly pushes the boundaries...
Well..
we,re trying to sell a lovely 5 Bed detached house in Gristhorpe, just outside Filey, if you,re interested !!
Gristhorpe
You made that name up, didn't you?
You all seem to be under the misapprehension
That Yorkshire/Lancashire is the North
My wife is from near Wigan and when we moved up to the Tyne Valley (Northumberland) she was asked how she was finding the North of England.
Its really wonderful here but if you're shuttling around the Yorks/Lancs cities then its not very practical - easy enough 2 hour trip but not someting you'd want to build into your day.
Don't know Yorks as well though I always liked Todmorden and the roads up into the hills round there. Lancaster is great but can I put in a good word for Last Drop, Bradshaw, Rivington? Hillside towns with lovely views - when it isn't raining. Which it usually is.
I love the idea
of a Yorkshireman being thought of as not northern. Being born on Teesside means I manage both at once though, so it don't bother me none :)
Teesside
I take it you were born in the 'boro then, not north of the river.
Coming from Hull I was frequently refered to as a Southerner when I lived in Teesside. My GLW (coming from Scotland) regards all us English folk as Southerners.
Cues Wedding Present track - I'm from further north than you.
Here you go mate!
..and no Parky in sight!
Great upload. "Banana's by the bunch! Apples by the pound!" It's like outtakes from Kes.
West Yorkshire!
I spent a lot of years in Todmorden and Hebden Bridge and love both - thriving arts and music scenes, independent shops, nice restaurants, cafes, surrounded by gorgeous scenery, and really not that far from the M62 - 30 minutes at most I'd say.
Hebden has always been the more expensive, you can buy more for your money in Todmorden. The range of houses is really good - terraces big and small, old farm houses, beautiful big yorkshire stone houses, converted barns...
Hebden is a bit more artsy and organic, Tod a little more down to earth, but neither suffer from clone-high-street so common in England.
Oh, over the hills is Colne, which looks great and hosts the Great British Blues Festival each year, worth looking there too!
How dare you
Pass so quickly over the trip over the hills!
An absolute and unending pleasure - I lived in Lancs for a couple of years and worked in Bradford (mystifyingly called Bratfott by my inlaws) for a while - the trip from Colne to Oxenhope to Bradford is just wonderful.
On a misty day you could end up in a reservoir but its a small price to pay
I stayed in Todmorden last week!
At the Staff of Life, just outside, on the road to Burnley. The food was great and the breakfast actually blew my mind, it was that good. They really know their stuff there. Hebden Bridge felt changed from when I was last there. It seemed to be either OAPS, or white boys in dreadlocks and Adidas.
50 reasons why Bolton is great
http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/9518522.50_reasons_why_Bolton_is_gre...
The guide is not very good at selling the town...
23 Little known fact two: Most disposable bedpans in the world are made in Bolton by Vernacare.
37 We have arguably the most zealous parking wardens in the world!
But I can agree with this (it is run by friends of mine!)
11 Ye Olde Pastie Shoppe is a veritable Bolton institution which started life as a butcher's shop in 1667. The queues outside every day say it all.
Reason 51 would be that Annie Haslam of Renaissance and the actor Robert Shaw were born here.
52. You're ten minutes from
52. You're ten minutes from Bury.
Bamburgh, Northumberland
I suspect it's a little too far for your needs but that's OK because it's a tiny place and I want to buy somewhere there one day.
The less competition the better! (smiley thing)
A vast castle (with private 12 apartments - all highly sought after) and a beautiful empty beach on everyone's doorstep. One of many tiny jewels that glitter on the north east coast.
Mmmmm Northumberland.
Absolutely the most beautiful county in England. The coastline, the castles, the Cheviots, Craster kippaz... Why, hev a spoach aroond for a hoose up there bonny lad.
Ah knaa
It's lush, man
Neebody knaa's it's there.
I'm from the Sooth
Bott since ah lornt ta taalk propper ah've last all me posh meets and ah divvent give a shite
(Misquote - probably - from a very old Viz ad for Geordie Linguaphone).
Northumberland is the best place in the country mind
I've heard that Alnwick ('Annick')
is very pleasant, but probably expensive now. Northumberland sounds good though.
It is, it is, and it is.
Funny that you say the l in nearby Alnmouth (Alanmouth!)
Seconded
Wonderful. But what do people do for a living? I love Alnwick and Alnmouth - go on holiday there as much as possible. But it quite a long way from anywhere.
Newcastle is pretty accessible by train
Though I live in the Tyne Valley so I'm a tourist up the coast as well.
Plenty of software companies in the NE, still quite a lot of engineering despite the best efforts of Whitehall and the CoL
Currently looking for work in that very place
It's a challenge to say the least.
Good luck
Do you mean up the coast or in Newcastle? Apparently the IT contract market is OK at the moment (not knowing what it is that you do though...)
Mrs Beezer
is not a Geordie (I had to apply for a dispensation to the Bobby Thompson Trust to allow the marriage to be considered) and insists on pronouncing it 'Alan Wick'
She also thinks I'm taking the mick when we go over Redheugh Bridge or drive past Ulgham...
I struggle with those too!
There do seem to be a lot of variations though. Mind you my Lancs wife pronounces Greenhaughs (NW England bakers) "Green Arches" so there really is no hope for me
That's because
it's Greenhalghs with an L. You see? It's clear now, isn't it?
* makes patronising clucking noise with back of tongue *
Lovely bread, as it happens. But not reason enough to live in Bolton.
I feel
Such a fool
:-)
The bread IS nice (they've expanded out towards Wigan over the years so I do go when visiting Lancs) but not so keen on the pies.
WHICH REMINDS ME
On the M6 recently near Bamber Bridge I saw a van with a sign on it - "No pies are left in this vehicle overnight"
Yes!!!!
Love it. I've seen that too. That's got to be a danger to other road users, surely.
Clearly a man of taste and refinement!
We could never afford Bamburgh. So we moved three years back to Seahouses - seven mile round trip along the best beach in the country, bar none.
Love Seahouses, go on
Love Seahouses, go on holiday there every year. Not as posh as Bamburgh but far more practical (it has a supermarket). If I could afford a second home anywhere in the UK it would be in Seahouses.
Seahouses!
Eatin' fish and chips by the roundabout!
Gan on, kidda. Seahouses is great. We had a week in a cottage in Beadnell last year and had a great time.
Yes, Bamburgh is magnificent. We must stop mentioning it or there'll be double figures on the beach next summer.
It's official: Carlisle
Just don't go to Oldham...
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2100600/Happiness-survey-Finds-9-10-unh...
Looking at that
it's interesting to sse, not the north south divide (though that's interestin gin its own way), but the fact that the places where people are unhappiest are urban areas.
The happiest places seem to be smaller, have a mix of buildings and architecture and green open spaces. I think we as a species are ill-equipped psychologically to deal with the mental strains of living in highly urbanised environments,yet the pressure seems to be increasing to do so. It' s part of what worries me about current economic policy: there seems to be a desire to pull people into the south East, even though the pressure on services and resources there is becoming much greater. Perhaps getting some people out of there instead might help their well-being (yes, I know, the BBC and Salford. I wouldn't move to Salford either - nothing personal, Salford, I just don't think I'd enjoy urban life that much any more.).
to be fair
The BBC people moving to Salford live in London. Salford is positively rural in comparison.
The BBC lot are all camping out in Hale and Bowden apparently (no doubt a sprinkling of Wimslow and Alderley Edge). I used to live in Hale and it is like a real life Stella Street.
All I can think of now
is the hoary old chestnut by the Macc Lads, "I Love Macc", which is little more than a list of all the pubs around Macclesfield, though it does begin with the lines:
A friend of my got married
A week last Saturday
And him and his wife moved out of Macc
And they bought a house in Hale
At least we know now, we can still ring 'em
At least it isn't Al-ter-incham
Hehehehehe
But gimme gimme gimme Macclesfield any bloody day.
One of their less offensive numbers, as I recall.
you want a list of pubs in Macclesfield?
Here you go, in no particular order:
Porters
Jolly sailor
Millstone
Nag's Head
Flower Pot (Twice)
Hollins
Dolphin
Railway View
Ship Inn
Snowgoose
Treacle Tap
Oxfford
Prince Albert
Park Lane Tavern
Last Orders
Blueberry
Bate Hall
Waters Green Tavern
Rising Sun
Brocklehurst Arms
Cock Inn (snigger)
Bull's Head
etc. etc. etc., bored now
*picks up baton*
The Old Millstone, The British Flag, The Swan Inn, The Pack Horse, The Lord Byron, The Beehive, The Swan with Two Necks, RIP The West Park, RIP The Three Pigeons. Over to you Twang.
Only another 46 to go according to beerintheevening.com
I do remember our dear geography teacher spending an entire lesson telling us that it was nothing like the old days when there used to be well over a hundred pubs in the town. Going to school in Macc, it was received wisdom that the town really did have the most pubs per head of population. It was believeable, until we broadened our horizons and went to Bollington next door. Now there's a place.
Well, here's the song...
Mmmm so many
I immediately think of The Oval, a marvellous example of horrid 70s pub - all Formica and fizzy beer - but I played my first gig there with my school band! And the equally horrid Weaver in Thornton Square, just across the road from my junior school. I learned about decent beer in the Jolly Sailor, but I had my first ever beer served to me in the tiny Castle on Churchwallgate. Yes you could drink in Macc. Zippo else to do, but drinking and running away from skinheads kept us busy.
Lovely thread
a most enjoyable read. For some inexplicable reason despite being a Dubliner I've always been a Sheffield Wednesday supporter and secretly dream of retiring to a house just outside Sheffield with a season ticket in my pocket. I've always liked visiting, and it's reassuring to read that it's actually, er, nice to live there.
Hillsborough
I used to live within spitting distance of the kop, and being a Barnsley fan, I did.
I'm still convinced that's why they put a roof on it.
Ah, a Dingle
I'm told
Ooh! Fighting talk
Ah dar a dee-dah den?
(Translation: "Are you from Sheffield then?")
No.
I remember attending an old Div 2 match involving the Owls at the Den around 79/80. To my dismay the lovely friendly Millwall fans were referring to the Wednesdayites as (among other things)'Dingles'.
I seem to recall Ian McMillan explaining the ins and outs of the Barnsley/Wednesday thing with attendant vernacular, most entertaining for us tourists.
I won't be allowed through passport control this weekend
if I don't mention Clitheroe. As a southern softie I was married there and despite this Mrs Phil's mum is still a pillar of the community.
As a small rural market town it's 25 minutes or so from the M6, Preston, Blackburn and Burnley; it sits on the edge of the Trough of Bowland; is in the shadow of Pendle Hill and on the banks of the River Ribble. Manchester and Lancaster are just over an hour away by train which also links to Carlisle. Harrogate and Leeds are about a 40 mile drive along the A59/A65.
There's the fabulous Cowman's Sausage Shop, Byrne's the wine merchant (a veritable treasure trove of tipples) and Dawson's who sell everything from a single tap washer to swanky barbecues and beyond. The Grand Arts Centre appears to be thriving and attracting a reasonable collection of acts (Leisure Society, Wilko Johnson, The Beat etc).
Finally, there's the New Inn. Nestling on the edge of the Castle grounds. It's delightfully shabby, but warm, characterful and the source of some of the best real ale and live music in the area.
York again
It's a nice place to be and lots of villages round about. We live 12 miles away and it's nice to have the access to York but also the countryside. Selby is our nearest town and it's not pretty but from where we are we have reasonable access to M62 and A64, which takes you over to Leeds/North Yorkshire or to West Yorkshire and also pretty good rail access to London and Transpennine trains to Manchester and Liverpool.
M62 between Hull and our area fantastic - lovely quiet road, but then it turns to a car park towards Leeds and beyond - hate it ! As people have said, you've got to think about where you're going to be travelling for your work and plonk yourself somewhere in the middle of it with good access to roads and maybe trains if needed.
For this area also I would suggest looking into flood risk, how often you get snowed in, rainfall (East is much drier than West/Pennines). There are a lot of military towns around Yorkshire and also a lot of high security prisons for some reason !
Whitby!
I would love to live in Whitby. Probably a bit too busy in summer with all us southern tourists about.
Might be a bit too far east for someone needing to travel across the whole of the north though.
I have very fond memories of sipping a few pints whilst listening to the folk musicians playing during the Folk Week. Also you can always say you live in the town where Dracula first landed in Britain. Plus the fish and chips are good.
How dare you!
The fish and chips are magnificent!
Sorry Jim
I think they probably were magnificent but I'd had a couple of snifters and I was fed up after queuing for ages!
Also I was traumatised after spending money to go into the Dracula Experience.
Trenchers or the Magpie?
... such a difficult choice. Best to spend at least 2 days in Whitby and you can do both, unless you're a thoroughgoing lardbucket like me.
Nah
Go in Royal Fisheries on Baxtergate for a take out; the owners, the Fusco family, also own the Quayside down near the Magpie. Or there's Mr Chips over the bridge. Both very good. Though I won't deny Trenchers or Magpie are good; just a bit pricey for what they are.
and the Tandoori at the Railway station is great too, as is the pie and mash ship, Humble Pie (q.v)
I'm going out on a limb here
but Trenchers may have the flashest toilets of any Fish and Chip restaurant I've ever been to.
That swings it for me. [As it were]
There's worse
I live on the West side. Oddly, it's not bad in summer (though it is busy) if you choose your moments, though I'm hidden away from the worst of it where I live. It can get busy at weekends especially and on Wednesday afternoons, when lots of day trippers turn up (ironic really, because a few people still do early closing on Wed) but being so close to the moors or some of the other coastal villages, like Robin Hoods Bay, or Sandsend, and some peace and quiet, it doesn't really matter. And for travel it's only about 40-50 minutes drive from Teesside and about the same form Scarborough. It's a nice drive too if you do the A171 (even the A174 near the coast isn't too bad).
PS: the fish and chips aren't just good. You can't fall over for fantastic chippies, and though I haven't been in for a while, Greens is a great restaurant if you want something a bit more sophisticated. And just round the corner on Church Street is Humble Pie and Mash, which is a really quite stunningly good pie shop, and fantastic value too.
And you can also say that you live in the town where the date for Easter was agreed. (Look up the Synod of Whitby). I'm only from Middlesbrough and have been here for about 12 years, but I wouldn't move back - I love it here.
Whitby is superb
We came up for the weekend when the 'famous' Chester FC played there. Beautiful place, great pubs and a really nice feel about the town. We stayed in Scarborough, and the whole area is just stunning. Highly recommended.
I live in Chester and work all over the North West and North Wales. Great place but a cultural desert. Maybe will improve when the new theatre (in an art deco Odeon cinema no less) finally gets built...
As is Chester
A place I really liked when I visited. And the drive down from there, round the north Wales coast down to around Bangor (didn't get much further, so I may have missed more good things) is also a joy.
This country (the UK) is blessed with loads of great stuff like that. We really don't know how lucky we are.
You missed the best bit
The run from Bangor/Caernarfon down the Lleyn Peninsula to Nefyn/Abersoch is a joy in itself. Once past Abersoch (lovely but overrun by moneyed weekend sailing clothes wearers) and Pwllheli the delights of Criccieth and Portmadog (and the wonderful Cob Records) onto Harlech, Barmouth and beyond is wonderful.
The country is indeed blessed, but the west coast of Wales, from Bangor down to Tenby, is probably the greatest secret we have.
I did get to Porthmadog
which was, as you say, lovely. But it was only a stop off on the inevitable trip to the handiwork of Clough Williams-Ellis, Portmeirion. And that is simply stunning.
Its a lovely little town
Many family holidays in and around there - usually trying to incorporate one of the roads over the tops into Bala on the way there and back. Watching the completion/reopening of the old narrow-gauge line from Prthmadog to Canaervon has been a pleasure as I used to walk the old trackbed as a child and imagine the trains coming back.
Portmeirion - oh yes. Clough-William-Ellis's own house is fantastic too, as is the miniature castle/folly nearby he got as a wedding present 'from his brother officers'. I've often wondered how they wrapped it up. Its not far from Porthmadog and definitely worth a diversion.
Wales is utterly wonderful...
I've been itching to post this for days
... this is the definitive guide to life in the North....
.... 'Appen!
OK Geordie, Stoart tha clap machine!
Frankie Vaughan - Stockport
Awwwwwwwww
I used to work with Tony Capstick at BBC Radio Sheffield. A brilliant, hilarious (and mildly terrifying) bloke.
Thanks Mooch
that brought back happy memories to an ageing geordie.And yes, I am still a fully affiliated CIU club member.Nothing has really changed doon the clyerb I am glad to say.Mind,I only go to watch the match.
Has to be Durham
for sheer splendour of the cathedral.....
Has to be Durham
for sheer splendour of the cathedral.....
I was in Durham last week
The Light and I were both visiting old friends in the north east. The cathedral is stunning, and what there is of the town centre is very handsome, but I had forgotten how small a town it is.
There are really just a couple of streets, so unless you fancy small town life I would highly recommend Durham for a weekend, but you might go stir crazy if you stay much longer.
It's where
I spent my student years. Much busier when the students are in town, though because of the demography of the intake (around 62% from the independent schools when I was there in the late 80s/early 90s), there was a bit of town/gown tension at times. And just a 20 minute train ride away from Newcastle if you get bored.