I do seem to have a slightly sado-masochistic streak when it comes to music. Please help me feed my desire for uncovering utter tripe by nominating your least favourite album (one you have actually heard please)

I’m going for Duran Duran’s shocking 1990 “release”, Liberty. At the time of it’s release all I was aware of was that a single, The Violence Of Summer, had tanked in pretty spectacular fashion. Subsequently, however, my fondness for early Duran has lead me to investigate some of their later works. So I came to Liberty with a fairly open mind. It really is the most shocking thing you will have ever heard. It’s first crime is that it aims to be cool – I think there was some attempt at trying to make something slightly in step with the house music that was big in the charts at the time. However, the resulting album, for the most part, sounds like the New Kids on the Block covering The J Geils Band..

As for the lyrics (and this is some achievement) they are by far the worst that Le Bon has ever howled along to. Much of the album is like the aural equivalent of a Pirelli-calendar, riddled with the kind of dated sex obsessed lyrics that were de rigour in 1990 (“look at me I have sex and I’m not afraid to sing about it in a vaguely covert fashion” – see also George Michael, Madonna and erm.. Colour Me Badd!!). You can almost hear the cocaine flying up their collective passages. Stomach this couplet if you dare:

“Divine blasphemer tempting holding beads of jism, with a scarlet chatachisim.” (from “Venice is Drowning “)

Every now and then David Hepworth throws a curveball and recommends something that comes as close to being a life changing experience as an art form can.

He did it with The Wire and then again with On Chesil Beach – and now he has pointed me in the direction of one of the most consistent albums ever made, Paul Simon’s There Goes Rhymin’ Simon

Had this been recorded with Art Garfunkel, then it would surely have been regarded as the best S&G album. Okay it doesn’t quite have anything as good as America or Only Living Boy in New York, but American Tune is not far off. Elsewhere the standards are consistently high, which is not something that can be said of Bookends or Bridge Over Troubled Water. As well as some great songs, the arrangements are among Simon’s finest, with help from Quincy Jones, The Dixie Hummingbirds and some New Orleans style horns courtesy from Allen Toussaint. I’m at an age now where there seem to be fewer and fewer albums that I enjoy listening to from end to end – so it was a true pleasure to discover this (I’m not quite putting it up there with Hissing of Summer Lawns but it comes pretty close in terms of the quality of the songs and the arrangements. Though Simon will never quite match Joni for sheer gravitas)

I'm still undecided as to whether this was very good or very bad. Please help...

The recent thread on the Clash set me thinking about all of those bands who I loved when I owned their greatest hits but as I gradually acquired their long players, my relationship deteriorated.

A prime example would be XTC. Fossil Fuel was like a bolt of lightning in my music collection, as though I had uncovered another dimension in pop history. Sadly similar thrills were few and far between on their long players (Skylarking had it’s moments but elsewhere the singles were massively superior)

Other examples are Queen (going from the near perfect Greatest Hits to the coke addled shams that were News Of the World and The Game was a major comedown), Elvis Costello (all his early albums are likeable rather than loveable), and Madness (same as Costello). In all of these examples, part of the problem is that the greatest hits are so perfect that going back to the albums will always disappoint. I should also note that in all of these cases, I discovered these artists back catalogues, largely through buying their greatest hits (I was too young for the material covered on Queen’s Greatest and Complete Madness, and most the singles on Elvis: The Man and Fossil Fuel didn’t get any radio play at the time of their original release)

Do the massive have any other examples (I know I’m going to shortly get a roasting from XTC and Costello fans!!)

Firstly - what a great album sleeve. The presence of Peter Saville was one of the key reasons in me buying this on CD (I never buy CDs these days)..

Musically - a mixed bag - there are a handful of tunes that have the raw atmosphere of their early stuff (New Babies:New Toys, New Holy Ground and The Right Side?).

But is it me or does far too much of the album have the sound of the 90s era OMD? Interviews with the band have promised an updating of their 80s sound for the 21st century but to these ears some of it is closer to mid-90s dance pop and for all the sleeve's intellectual pretensions, the lyrics are largely the kind of lovey-dovey nonsense that Mcluskey might have tossed off to Atomic Kitten. Still there are some good tunes in there??

What say (the invariably small section of) the massive (who are still listening)?

I felt compelled to post something having recently watched Donovan’s Sunshine Superman DVD, which traces his entire career from his travelling / busking days through to the noughties.

Firstly, what a great DVD – I think this is possibly the best rock biog documentary I’ve ever seen. There’s an unbelievable amount of footage even going back to his pre-fame days busking around England with Gypsy Dave. Not only this but the contemporary interviews with the man himself retrace his travels around the world and climax with a reunion with Gypsy in the Greek islands.

Secondly, it reminded me of how great the man’s music was – most notably the gorgeous jazz tinged, Sunny Goodge Street, which takes you straight to the London of the early 60s (all Johnny Dankworth in coffee bars and French cigarettes). Not to mention the unique Hurdy Gurdy Man which features no less than three future members of the mighty Led Zep.

Thirdly, what a compelling man. Initially, the wishy-washy hippy philosophy and endless self-complements (along the lines of “my 60s work was hugely important and also quite brilliant”), makes you wonder how you’ll endure his three hour running commentary. And there’s also his continual claims (while sitting in his Irish country mansion) to be leading the “gypsy lifestyle”..

But as the film progresses he gradually wins you over. He’s right, his 60s work was brilliant (and important – albeit not to everyone). And while his musings on mediation, the “other” realm and various hippy related idealisms are frequently dogmatic and ill-thought out, his naivety here is part of his charm – and once you go with it you start to become in awe of the life he has led (travelling, playing guitar and meditating his way into another world)

So hail Donovan, prince of the colourful noise of the universe…

Peace out!!!

Those who have read Nick Hornby’s Hi Fidelity will recall the character Rob’s top 5 Costello Tunes (possibly based on Hornby’s own tastes I suspect?).

His choices were as follows:

Alison (My Aim is True)
Little Triggers (This Years Model)
Man Out of Time (Imperial Bedroom)
King Horse (Get Happy)
Everyday I write the book (Punch the Clock)

Though all of these are fine tunes there is a slight lack of his slightly later work which I’m rather fond of. Spike, Brutal Youth and especially Mighty Like the Rose all house some of his finest songs and don’t have too much in the way of filler. So I ask the massive to cast aside any biases toward his trendy early stuff or, indeed, toward showing off your knowledge by only including album tracks and b-sides and tell me what your 5 favourite Costello tracks are.

My choices are (in no particular order)

Accidents Will Happen (Armed Forces) – Probably his most joyous pop melody but with a typically bitter tone to the lyrics. Also one of the great examples of a hit single with no intro whatsoever AND (unlike Oliver’s Army) it still sounds fresh having not been played to death. On the one hand its great that he continued to evolve but on the other a great shame that he never quite managed to churn out any more pop confections of this order

Couldn’t call it unexpected No.4 (Mighty Like the Rose) – Using music composed for Alan Bleasedale’s TV series, GBH, Costello adds a vocal melody and lyric that twists and turns in all directions over the four minute track. A beautiful song which disposes of the standard verse / chorus structure but still keeps the listener compelled.

Veronica (Spike) The poppiest thing he has released since Armed Forces – combining with McCartney to great effect.

Shipbuilding (Punch the Clock) – No real need to comment here.

New Lace Sleeves (Trust) – The most underrated of his early albums contains this incredible song – again Costello showing an amazing talent to produce numerous unexpected melodic twists within the confines of a pop song.

Common People by Pulp is indeed one of the finest songs of our time. It has grown in stature due in part to the cleverness of the lyric and Jarvis Cocker's immaculate delivery...

However there is one moment which stands above all others in the song...the build up to that moment is:

"I said 'pretend you've got no money' / But she just laughed and said 'oh you're so funny'/ I said 'yeah, well I can't see anyone else smiling in here'"

and then the greatest moment, when Jarvis simply whispers - "Are you sure?"

..this line works, just like the song as a whole, on a number of different levels - but the delivery is key. In this one line, Jarvis manages to be clever, cocky, innocent AND sneaky, while STILL managing to make a very pertinent social observation AND maintaining the drama and emotion of the song - GENIUS!!!

So I'd like to hear from the massive their favourite examples of single lines in songs which stand out and grab you... (it could be a really clever lyric or something which acts as a peak to the overall drama of the song)...

I’ll be spending some of this weekend spotifying the recent Indie Singles thread. Great to have recommendations for some of the more obscure things that I haven’t heard before (though my own selections were admittedly quite mainstream)… I’m wondering if this list will be a bit less varied than the one for singles?

My selection are:

New Order – Technique
The Smiths – Strangeways Here We Come
Primal Scream – Screamadelica

Partly as another exercise in list-making and partly as an aid to discovering any classics that I may have missed.

One single per artist…
The only criteria is that they were released on an indie label (I remember the NME doing a top 100 indie singles in the mid 90s and I’m sure that some of the 2 Tone and Stiff releases qualified as indie. Our House and Gangsters were certainly in the list.)

Mine are:

1 Suede – The Wild Ones (Nude)
2 Primal Scream – Star (Creation)
3 The Pixies – Here Comes Your Man (4AD)

The first is a band at the peak of their song-writing prowess, the second is a band fusing dub, indie and ambient music into one irresistible whole…

…and while it was tempting to go for one of the Pixie’s standard noise-fests, this is the one that really brings a smile to the face…

I was quite suprised to find on the recent thread, "Albums that would be even better if you ditched one track", that there are Beatles fans who really don't like "Day in the Life" and "She Said She Said"!

The former I had always considered to be the peak of Lennon / McCartney / George Martin's creativity, while the latter I had always felt best represented the "cool" edge of the Beatles (ie: the tunes which have gone on to inspire a million indie bands)

So the challenge here is to find the Beatle track that everyone likes. I'm going to make a suggestion and if someone does'nt like it then they can make another suggestion until we get one that everyone agrees is great?

My choice is Ticket to Ride. It came fairly near to the middle of their career and marked perfeclty the transition between the early and late Beatles sound...

Just an experiment - it might not work but hey ho...over to the massive...

Apologies if we’ve done this before but I’m currently reading Philip Norman’s Lennon biog and it got me thinking. Its always nice when a book like Norman’s comes along. It really is the definitive Lennon book and really hammers home how far off the mark all of the previous books have been. It’s respectfully written but an interesting insight all the same and, more importantly, by avoiding any overt bitchiness, it enhances the fan’s appreciation of the music.

The first biography I ever read was Jerry Hopkin’s Bowie and, as with the recent Lennon book, it really enhanced my appreciation of Bowie’s music. However (as you’ll see below), the quality level among Bowie books is hugely varied.

My vote for best rock biog goes unanimously (with apologies to Luke Haines) to Head On / Repossessed by St Julian of Cope. This wacky travelogue through the road of success, self loss and rediscovery is brilliantly written and on many occasions utterly hilarious. From small observations such as Pete Wylie’s tendency to refer to Bowie as “Dave Bowie” to his legendary “popping out for a pint of milk while on acid” anecdote which involves trailing several miles and wading across rivers. What really shines through (particularly with the second part – repossessed) is how different from the typical rock biography narrative this book strays (there are a couple of make album / plug on tour bits but most of it is about Cope finding his own way and ultimately shaking off any possibility of a comfortable rock star existence by turning down a very tempting offer by Levis)

My vote for worst goes to Stuart Hoggard’s Changes. This dates from about 1985 and pretty much follows the premise that Bowie was at his best when he got “clean” and started playing the game (ie: The mid-80s).
The author has a strong dislike of anything a bit “weird” (ie: the whole point of Bowie). He is particularly scathing of Low and Heroes, expressing a verbal “phew” when Bowie returns to regular song based albums on Lodger.

Classic line (from memory) – on Bowie’s Nazi salute – “you don’t fuck with fascism man!”

Would the massive care to nominate a top 20 hit that really didn’t sound like the kind of thing you usually get in the charts?

My nomination is – Ghosts by Japan (no rhythm track to speak of, avante garde keyboard sections, a lyric as dark as an ink blot at midnight)

I’m interested to hear from the massive about any songs which they find sonically repugnant but cannot resist cutting a rug to when the crowd gets going….

For me the out and out winner has to be Two Princes by the Spin Doctors….

Had I admitted in any student union bar in about 1993 to having liked this corporate-come-soap-dodging turd of a song I would have had several pints of snakebite poured over my head…

…but once it sounded over the P.A. at the indie disco – there was no stopping me….(in fact even the thought of its funky shuffle now makes me twitch a little)

…on the recent Glastonbury thread someone wisely referred to Muse as “It Bites playing Simple Minds B-Sides” – high praise indeed.

This lead me to think about bands who achieve significant success in their prime but whose records line the shelves of second hand shops a few years later…

I’m thinking Travis, Stereophonics, Simple Minds, Texas, etc… the type of bands who chase the money but not the myth….

Now I QUITE like Muse to the extent that if Supermassive Blackhole turns up on shuffle then I wont skip it (and sometimes I ponder how good it would be if all the tunes on my ipod sounded that polished)

– BUT they seem to aspire to being big, playing in stadiums and selling lots of CDs more than anything else and for some reason that really shows… they’re what Radiohead would sound like if they valued money over art. So whereas acts like Nick Drake, Talk Talk and the Velvet Underground mature with age – Muse are the opposite and their flame will surely go out very soon…

what say you Massive?